The Rawkus Curse?

[B. Ware tha Siniq]

The Ecstatic is not arguably as good on any planet. DPB!

[B. Ware tha Siniq]

you're missing the main point anyway. You want to talk about "curses?"

Let's look at Bad Boy's roster over the last 20 years, or Death Row's, or Roc-A-Fella's post Jay, etc.

[Philaflava]

The same album that has an out of place Slick Rick verse about some fucking faggot kid in Afghanistan? It's a decent album and the production was nice (thanks Jackson bros) but Life in Marvelous Times might be the pinnacle of it.

Besides the anthem Fat Booty, what is fucking with Hip Hop, Mathematics or Mr Nigga? BOBS is def better and there shouldn't be an argument unless you're being argumentative for the sake of being argumentative.

[Philaflava]

you're missing the main point anyway. You want to talk about "curses?"

Let's look at Bad Boy's roster over the last 20 years, or Death Row's, or Roc-A-Fella's post Jay, etc.

Go for it. We need some stimulation in this forum. PS you know me too well.

[B. Ware tha Siniq]

BOBS is def better and there shouldn't be an argument unless you're being argumentative for the sake of being argumentative.

yes, I am. But others on this very site have made the argument before. Hence it's "arguable" in a loose sense of the word. However, I do realize that when I made the oh so bold statement that Illmatic was objectively better than IWW, it inspired more scorned IWW fans than I knew existed to say I don't know my ass from a hole in the ground - so I do get that somebody will argue anything.

[COOLEHMAGAZINE]

The same album that has an out of place Slick Rick verse about some fucking faggot kid in Afghanistan? It's a decent album and the production was nice (thanks Jackson bros) but Life in Marvelous Times might be the pinnacle of it.

Besides the anthem Fat Booty, what is fucking with Hip Hop, Mathematics or Mr Nigga? BOBS is def better and there shouldn't be an argument unless you're being argumentative for the sake of being argumentative.

Will gladly argue this all day. They are totally different album trying to do different things but you put Fat Booty over Brooklyn? We don't even like the same songs on that record then.

Either way, Priority, LIMT, Wahid, Supermagic, Auditorium, Twilite Speedball are all dope.


BOBS has a lot of standouts but also some serious filler. It is very, very arguable. You don't even fuck with Mos though, you obviously like BOBS and that's it, so I am not surprised.

[Philaflava]

you use the word dope loosely as if an album has 4 dope songs its automatically amazing. production was nice and compared to his two previous duds it was a breath of fresh air. still, i think his debut is significantly better overall including the filler.

those "dope" songs you mentioned are cool. it was an improvement but that auditorium was the worst collabos i've ever heard by two legitimate great emcees.

[COOLEHMAGAZINE]

you use the word dope loosely as if an album has 4 dope songs its automatically amazing. production was nice and compared to his two previous duds it was a breath of fresh air. still, i think his debut is significantly better overall including the filler.

those "dope" songs you mentioned are cool. it was an improvement but that auditorium was the worst collabos i've ever heard by two legitimate great emcees.

I like Auditorium. But I think Mos succeeded in what he was trying to do with the album. It's a pretty singular piece of work, not perfect, but neither is BOBS. And honestly, I think The Ecstatic is ultimately going to hold up to the passage of time better. I can't really listen to BOBS all the way through very often.

What was Mos supposed to become? Who would he be, in your eyes, without this underachievement? Q-Tip?

[Philaflava]

i agree it probably will hold up better and there was progression for sure. but just because something doesn't age well doesn't mean it's not a better piece of work (overall). truthfully after he got man handled by Hitchens I couldn't even listen to Mos the same. forget his horrible movies or atrocious albums after BOBS.

[Gyangsta 4 Life]

You could probably count on two hands the number of rappers who weren't perceived as having fallen off after their first 3-5 years in da game.

[Employee]

Cool island wisdom, bruh.

[Mark 563]

Rawkus, directly as a label, really has no decent track record when it comes to artists albums (give or take Co Flow 'Funchrusher Plus', as I thought this was released on Official, distributed through Rawkus, but discogs seems to suggest otherwise). Compilations is a slightly different story:

'Soundbombing' was an incredible mix of previously released 12"s, that most fans from that era already owned.

'Soundbombing II' was a great mix, but deviated from the previous mix, with more focus on new material. Most of these tracks dropped around the same time on 12", so were scooped up by the vinyl buyers at the time.

'Lyricists Lounge' a decent compilation that spawned a few great 12"s.

Other than the Black Star, Mos Def, Pharoahe and Big L albums, most other LPs were only distributed through Rawkus, right? And even by this time (1999 / 2000), the label, with regards to quality of output, was certainly considered to be in decline by many of the heads I knew.

For me, ignoring the first couple of 12"s, Rawkus was at it's best in the 1997-1999 era or 12" singles with the Shabaam Sahdeeq, Sir Menelik, B-One, Mos Def, L-Fudge, Reflection Eternal, Black Attack, Brick City Kids, Medina Green. Most stuff after 'Soundbombing II' was a disappointment.

[ackbar]

i guess you're talking about "taste"..
but mos def, el-p, talib kweli all went on to greater success after that era you're talking about.

[Mark 563]

i guess you're talking about "taste"..
but mos def, el-p, talib kweli all went on to greater success after that era you're talking about.

Greater success, lesser quality?

[ackbar]

i like kweli's first solo record more than blackstar (tho it's still on rawkus). a case can be made for the def jux stuff over co flow as well

[the dead poet]

Monch has put out quality music since rawkus. I will hear no arguments saying otherwise.

[Mark 563]

i like kweli's first solo record more than blackstar (tho it's still on rawkus). a case can be made for the def jux stuff over co flow as well

I've never really cared for Kweli. Of all the early Rawkus material, his releases tended to be my least favourite. Even that 'Fortified Live' / '2000 Seasons' 12" didn't do much for me aside from Mos Def's appearance.

And I never was much of a Def Jux fan, despite really enjoying 'Funcrusher Plus'. I bought 'The Cold Vein' and 'Labour Days' on the strength of recommendations, and sold both pretty soon after - I just couldn't get open to 'em - and only sporadically enjoyed El-P 12"s.

Monch has put out quality music since rawkus. I will hear no arguments saying otherwise.

Maybe he has, but for me, nothing I've heard since has superseded the quality of his Rawkus album (and even that album didn't really bang like I'd hoped).

[The Afronaut]

So did all those Rawkus 50 records actually get released, or were they just planned?

Also, did Rawkus have a decent 12" catalog, or am I somehow blending them with Fondle Em in my mind?

[Ned Ryerson]

Monch has put out quality music since rawkus. I will hear no arguments saying otherwise.

[Employee]

Talib Kweli is not good by any metric.

[ardamus]

i agree it probably will hold up better and there was progression for sure. but just because something doesn't age well doesn't mean it's not a better piece of work (overall). truthfully after he got man handled by Hitchens I couldn't even listen to Mos the same. forget his horrible movies or atrocious albums after BOBS.

Well, movies and odd name change aside, Ecstatic was that album where you were like "ok, Mos got it right this time". I just remember hearing New Danger and being very underwhelmed by it. True Magic was better but, the very fact the sound quality came off as a demo in comparison to the sound quality of the his previous albums was bad. Ecstatic just kind of brought it back to what I think fans were waiting to get from Mos. So I have to agree with COOLEH, it'll be an album that will stand the test of time.

Monch has put out quality music since rawkus. I will hear no arguments saying otherwise.

In comparison, he honestly was the most consistent solo artist when it came to projects. Don't give a fuck what this board says (because there's been complaints about his shit after Organized Konfusion and Internal Affairs), he's been able to pick better production and craft better songs than a good portion of the Rawkus roster afterwards. Mos and Talib are the same except for output which Talib has had more of; they both have chosen some questionable production in a project or two.

[Philaflava]

i agree it probably will hold up better and there was progression for sure. but just because something doesn't age well doesn't mean it's not a better piece of work (overall). truthfully after he got man handled by Hitchens I couldn't even listen to Mos the same. forget his horrible movies or atrocious albums after BOBS.

Well, movies and odd name change aside, Ecstatic was that album where you were like "ok, Mos got it right this time". I just remember hearing New Danger and being very underwhelmed by it. True Magic was better but, the very fact the sound quality came off as a demo in comparison to the sound quality of the his previous albums was bad. Ecstatic just kind of brought it back to what I think fans were waiting to get from Mos. So I have to agree with COOLEH, it'll be an album that will stand the test of time.

Ecstatic was like, oh finally a glimpse of what Mos is capable of. It's like when Nas made Stillmatic and we all were like "YES one step closer to Illmatic."

[Mark 563]

Also, did Rawkus have a decent 12" catalog, or am I somehow blending them with Fondle Em in my mind?

Yes. There 12" catalogue from 1997 - 1999 is the reason they had the reputation they had. They were primarily a 12" based company.

[ardamus]

i agree it probably will hold up better and there was progression for sure. but just because something doesn't age well doesn't mean it's not a better piece of work (overall). truthfully after he got man handled by Hitchens I couldn't even listen to Mos the same. forget his horrible movies or atrocious albums after BOBS.

Well, movies and odd name change aside, Ecstatic was that album where you were like "ok, Mos got it right this time". I just remember hearing New Danger and being very underwhelmed by it. True Magic was better but, the very fact the sound quality came off as a demo in comparison to the sound quality of the his previous albums was bad. Ecstatic just kind of brought it back to what I think fans were waiting to get from Mos. So I have to agree with COOLEH, it'll be an album that will stand the test of time.

Ecstatic was like, oh finally a glimpse of what Mos is capable of. It's like when Nas made Stillmatic and we all were like "YES one step closer to Illmatic."

I actually never thought Stillmatic was anywhere near close to being as good as Illmatic so I don't agree with you there; good album still but c'mon, replacing an original classic in a career is minimal to non-existent. With Ecstatic, I didn't have to skip any songs when I wanted to listen to it the whole way through; like Black On Both Sides and the 1st Black Star album. New Danger......I skipped through that whole album. True Magic......half of the album. At the end of the day, I can listen to Ecstatic and like it with every few complaints.

[Philaflava]

Stillmatic wasn't anywhere close to Illmatic, the point was he was finally headed in the right direction.

[ardamus]

Stillmatic wasn't anywhere close to Illmatic, the point was he was finally headed in the right direction.

[ardamus]

Speaking of former artists on Rawkus.....


Thought it was a good interview.

[Philaflava]

This was his Christopher Hitchens incident.

Talib Kweli Admits To Being Slapped By A Woman On Hot 97

SEVERAL weeks ago a rumor about Talib Kweli being slapped by a woman at a 50 Cent party made its way around the industry. Not only did the rumor say he got his jaw tapped, but then he went into a private room at 50’s house and cried. Well, Kweli went on Hot 97’s Miss Jones in the morning to set the record straight.


“I was at 50’s house and I got to an argument with my girl,” Talib told Jones. “It got physical. Ain’t nobody go into a room was crying. But ya know, I’m a passionate dude and sometimes women get passionate. So you know, she got out of pocket and she got checked. It was an ugly situation for both parties, it didn’t make either one of us look good, but I’m glad it’s over with.”

[Ned Ryerson]

Monch has put out quality music since rawkus. I will hear no arguments saying otherwise.

In comparison, he honestly was the most consistent solo artist when it came to projects. Don't give a fuck what this board says (because there's been complaints about his shit after Organized Konfusion and Internal Affairs), he's been able to pick better production and craft better songs than a good portion of the Rawkus roster afterwards. Mos and Talib are the same except for output which Talib has had more of; they both have chosen some questionable production in a project or two.

I think I like Desire more than than Internal Affairs. It took a minute to grow on me cause I went into it hoping for a bunch of songs like Rape. Internal Affairs has some great songs but Desire is way more cohesive. Doesn't seem fair to compare their careers post Rawkus though since Mos and Talib were just starting out on Rawkus where as Monch had been doing his thing for almost 10 years at that point

[RacquetballGangsta]

only thing is that list (rawkus 50) even sucked back then