Yo, it seems like we got a few players here. so this thread is for everyone to post any poker related questions/discussions/stories.
here is a link to the other threads we have had in the past
Pokerroom.com Appreciation Thread
http://www.philaflava.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15482
and
Poker Must Have Books
http://www.philaflava.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=23629
The Official Poker Thread for the 2005.
Moderator: Gregg Popabitch
heres an article by Daniel N. its pretty dope.
link here
http://www.cardplayer.com/poker_magazin ... a_id=13375
The Truth About Tells
by Daniel Negreanu
I
link here
http://www.cardplayer.com/poker_magazin ... a_id=13375
The Truth About Tells
by Daniel Negreanu
I
i hate that guy.
something about him just screams "i'm a fruit"..
anyway, i've been playing a lot more 7 card stud (no homo) and omaha lately, both live and on line. anyone else been switching away from hold 'em lately? i mean, it's still my favorite game, but omaha has been my game of choice lately...
we had about 8 people over here a few days ago, and we were playing .25/.50 dealer calls the game...i think i dealt probably 4 times, and picked omaha or 7 card all 4 times...
then, i dealt black jack with a 3 dollar limit, and won 100 bucks in an hour...house always wins!
something about him just screams "i'm a fruit"..
anyway, i've been playing a lot more 7 card stud (no homo) and omaha lately, both live and on line. anyone else been switching away from hold 'em lately? i mean, it's still my favorite game, but omaha has been my game of choice lately...
we had about 8 people over here a few days ago, and we were playing .25/.50 dealer calls the game...i think i dealt probably 4 times, and picked omaha or 7 card all 4 times...
then, i dealt black jack with a 3 dollar limit, and won 100 bucks in an hour...house always wins!
Tournament Experts Versus Live Game Experts
By David Sklansky
In this article I will endeavor to explain why the best tournament players and the best live game players are not always the same people. The fact is that there are several different skill sets needed for the two different types of competition. And I am not talking merely about the importance or lack of importance of "survival." That is why only a few players are truly great at both high stakes live games and high buy-in poker tournaments.
Let us now take a look at some of those required skills.
Tournament Skills
Preserving chips. Since you are all done when you lose your buy-in, good players are making a mistake if they risk all or most of their chips with a small "edge" (especially playing no-limit with a decent sized stack). There are two reasons. One is that the reward is not really worth the risk since you are risking not only chips but also the opportunity to keep playing and extracting future edges. Secondly, the way prizes are handed out makes it mathematically wrong to take close gambles for big money especially near the end of the tournament. (This is true even if you didn't play better than your average opponent.)
Though the above concepts are very important as regards tournaments I do not consider knowledge of them one of the key things that separates tournament champs from live game champs. The reason is that almost all live game experts are quite cognizant of them when they are in a tournament.
When not to preserve chips. One thing the best tournament players understand better than most other pros is that things reverse regarding chip preservation when their stacks have shrunk and there is still more players to be knocked out before getting "into the money." Now you have to gamble, especially if the blinds are coming up. The point at which things change is what Dan Harrington calls the "inflection point." Be sure to read his thoughts on the subject. (Editor's note: Inflection points will be discussed in detail when Harrington on Hold 'em; Expert Strategy for No-Limit Tournaments: Volume II: End Play is released in the spring of 2005.)
Expertise against moderate or poor opponents. I believe this may be the biggest single reason that some high stakes live game players do not do as well as one might expect when they play tournaments. They are not adept at extracting the maximum (or losing the minimum) when up against weak opponents. And even the highest buy-in tournaments have a good percentage of players with quite a bit less skill than the opponents that top ring players are used to playing. I'm not saying that the live game players will actually lose to these mediocre players. But many of them don't beat these "weakies" out of nearly as much as tournament pros do.
Taking advantage of other's "Fear of Busting Out." I won't go into the details of how to do this. Read my Tournament Poker for Advanced Players for a thorough treatment of the subject. For now be aware that typical players play differently in a tournament than they do in side games and the correct counter strategy is also different. Tournament pros tend to be more aware of what that strategy is. (In a nutshell it means more betting and folding, and less calling and raising [except on the first round].)
Playing with or against short stacks. This is another skill that many live game pros are lacking. That's not surprising of course since big games rarely contain players who allow themselves to become short. But the fact is that knowing when to go all-in on an early round, either as a bettor or a caller, is an actual skill (and a difficult one to learn) if the situation comes up frequently. So in fully understanding the ramifications of playing when there is a side pot, live game players who don't learn this stuff are at a big disadvantage in a tournament.
Live Game Skills
Beating top players playing their best. There are at least two reasons most people think that the high stakes side game pros are better than tournament pros and this is one of them. (The other is that side game pros make more money.) Tournament pros do not face a high proportion of excellent players. And those they do face are somewhat handcuffed by survival considerations as well as the fact that there are usually some bad players at the table. So a tournament pro doesn't have to adjust much if there is a $1,000-$2,000 player in his game.
A top side game player on the other hand is almost always facing all good players with no constraints on them. Few can do this profitably.
Avoiding and taking advantage of tilt. Players are much less apt to go on tilt in tournaments than in side games. There are a few reasons for this. The most obvious being that the bad beats that might normally put someone on tilt have probably eliminated him from the tournament. Thus the skill of keeping yourself from going on tilt and honing in on those who have, are not developed by strictly tournament pros. (In fact, some of them are legendary "tilters" in side games.) But these skills are critical in regular games, especially the big ones where much of the profit comes from catching an opponent playing worse than usual.
Reading hands when there are many possibilities. It is a lot tougher to read hands in a high stakes side game. Players are not nearly as reluctant to push the envelope with marginal hands. Obviously the more hands your opponent might have the harder it is to figure out which hand he really does have. Only the best higher stakes side games players can do this well.
Pushing small edges. There are many hands that are on the borderline between positive and negative EV. And it is not easy to recognize which of these will in fact make money. Furthermore, those that do will only make money if played skillfully. But tournament pros do not need to fully understand how to play those marginal hands and which ones they are because they usually fold them anyway. It is wrong to push small edges in tournaments. Not so in side games, especially big ones, where large edges are hard to come by. A $400-$800 player who doesn't seize a small edge when he has it, will not win.
Understanding multi-way pots. There are a lot fewer multi-way pots during high buy-in tournaments than in typical side games. (The exception might be very high stakes shorthanded games.) And the correct strategy for these multi-way pots is often quite different than it is for heads-up pots. Tournament pros are sometimes a little weak in correctly applying the principles of multi-way play but they can get away with it. Not so for side game players.
By David Sklansky
In this article I will endeavor to explain why the best tournament players and the best live game players are not always the same people. The fact is that there are several different skill sets needed for the two different types of competition. And I am not talking merely about the importance or lack of importance of "survival." That is why only a few players are truly great at both high stakes live games and high buy-in poker tournaments.
Let us now take a look at some of those required skills.
Tournament Skills
Preserving chips. Since you are all done when you lose your buy-in, good players are making a mistake if they risk all or most of their chips with a small "edge" (especially playing no-limit with a decent sized stack). There are two reasons. One is that the reward is not really worth the risk since you are risking not only chips but also the opportunity to keep playing and extracting future edges. Secondly, the way prizes are handed out makes it mathematically wrong to take close gambles for big money especially near the end of the tournament. (This is true even if you didn't play better than your average opponent.)
Though the above concepts are very important as regards tournaments I do not consider knowledge of them one of the key things that separates tournament champs from live game champs. The reason is that almost all live game experts are quite cognizant of them when they are in a tournament.
When not to preserve chips. One thing the best tournament players understand better than most other pros is that things reverse regarding chip preservation when their stacks have shrunk and there is still more players to be knocked out before getting "into the money." Now you have to gamble, especially if the blinds are coming up. The point at which things change is what Dan Harrington calls the "inflection point." Be sure to read his thoughts on the subject. (Editor's note: Inflection points will be discussed in detail when Harrington on Hold 'em; Expert Strategy for No-Limit Tournaments: Volume II: End Play is released in the spring of 2005.)
Expertise against moderate or poor opponents. I believe this may be the biggest single reason that some high stakes live game players do not do as well as one might expect when they play tournaments. They are not adept at extracting the maximum (or losing the minimum) when up against weak opponents. And even the highest buy-in tournaments have a good percentage of players with quite a bit less skill than the opponents that top ring players are used to playing. I'm not saying that the live game players will actually lose to these mediocre players. But many of them don't beat these "weakies" out of nearly as much as tournament pros do.
Taking advantage of other's "Fear of Busting Out." I won't go into the details of how to do this. Read my Tournament Poker for Advanced Players for a thorough treatment of the subject. For now be aware that typical players play differently in a tournament than they do in side games and the correct counter strategy is also different. Tournament pros tend to be more aware of what that strategy is. (In a nutshell it means more betting and folding, and less calling and raising [except on the first round].)
Playing with or against short stacks. This is another skill that many live game pros are lacking. That's not surprising of course since big games rarely contain players who allow themselves to become short. But the fact is that knowing when to go all-in on an early round, either as a bettor or a caller, is an actual skill (and a difficult one to learn) if the situation comes up frequently. So in fully understanding the ramifications of playing when there is a side pot, live game players who don't learn this stuff are at a big disadvantage in a tournament.
Live Game Skills
Beating top players playing their best. There are at least two reasons most people think that the high stakes side game pros are better than tournament pros and this is one of them. (The other is that side game pros make more money.) Tournament pros do not face a high proportion of excellent players. And those they do face are somewhat handcuffed by survival considerations as well as the fact that there are usually some bad players at the table. So a tournament pro doesn't have to adjust much if there is a $1,000-$2,000 player in his game.
A top side game player on the other hand is almost always facing all good players with no constraints on them. Few can do this profitably.
Avoiding and taking advantage of tilt. Players are much less apt to go on tilt in tournaments than in side games. There are a few reasons for this. The most obvious being that the bad beats that might normally put someone on tilt have probably eliminated him from the tournament. Thus the skill of keeping yourself from going on tilt and honing in on those who have, are not developed by strictly tournament pros. (In fact, some of them are legendary "tilters" in side games.) But these skills are critical in regular games, especially the big ones where much of the profit comes from catching an opponent playing worse than usual.
Reading hands when there are many possibilities. It is a lot tougher to read hands in a high stakes side game. Players are not nearly as reluctant to push the envelope with marginal hands. Obviously the more hands your opponent might have the harder it is to figure out which hand he really does have. Only the best higher stakes side games players can do this well.
Pushing small edges. There are many hands that are on the borderline between positive and negative EV. And it is not easy to recognize which of these will in fact make money. Furthermore, those that do will only make money if played skillfully. But tournament pros do not need to fully understand how to play those marginal hands and which ones they are because they usually fold them anyway. It is wrong to push small edges in tournaments. Not so in side games, especially big ones, where large edges are hard to come by. A $400-$800 player who doesn't seize a small edge when he has it, will not win.
Understanding multi-way pots. There are a lot fewer multi-way pots during high buy-in tournaments than in typical side games. (The exception might be very high stakes shorthanded games.) And the correct strategy for these multi-way pots is often quite different than it is for heads-up pots. Tournament pros are sometimes a little weak in correctly applying the principles of multi-way play but they can get away with it. Not so for side game players.
Avoiding Tilt When the Underdog Wins
By Wesley Young
As many experts have said, poker is a game that must be viewed as one continuous session that lasts a lifetime. If one can keep this simple statement in mind, it can make the short-term variances, or luck, less painful when the underdog wins. Recently this point was driven home to me not once, but twice in the same night.
I often play in a local weekly no-limit Texas hold 'em tournament and the following two hands came up involving my wife and me. Just before I left, she decided to play in her first poker tournament and went with me. She was very nervous and I told her to play like she had learned and not like Gus Hansen. As it turned out, she lasted longer than I did and just missed the money. She played tight and aggressive and got all in with the odds in her favor when it mattered.
The first hand to discuss is the one that knocked me out. I was under the gun and had about 900 chips left. (The average was 1,500.) When I looked down and saw pocket aces, I decided to move all in, as I had built a rather loose image and felt one of the large stacks would try to keep me honest. Well, I got my wish. A very solid player in middle position raised all-in for about 500 more to isolate me, and we had no other takers. When he turned over ace-king off suit I was elated. This made me over 92 percent to double up.
Of course, if my aces had held up you wouldn't be reading about it here. After all of the burns and turns the board read Q, T, 6, T, J giving him a straight and me a seat on the sidelines.
The next hand is the one that knocked my wife out. It was down to four players and she and the other middle-sized stack both got all in before the flop. She had ace-king offsuit against his ace-eight suited, which made her a 69 percent favorite. After the flop came K, T, 9 rainbow she was 91 percent to win. The turn was a six and the river was a seven, giving him a straight and her a place beside me. She would have been the chip leader and in the money if she would have won that hand.
Some people would whine about both of these as being bad beats and act like the cards owed them something. The way I choose to look at these situations is a little different, and helps keep me focused and off tilt. If I'm a 95 percent favorite and the 5 percent wins, then I feel that the next time I'll be a 96 percent favorite because I know that I'll win 95 out of 100 times and I've already used up one of the losses. I also know that if I continue to strive to put myself in these situations, I will be successful.
Of course this is not the only method one can use to avoid tilt. Here are some suggestions and methods that work for some players. The most important thing is to have a plan in place ahead of time. So find something that works for you and your game and stick with it.
Understand that you will receive bad beats as a poker player. As a matter of fact you will receive more bad beats, as you become a better player. This is because you will be less likely to get your money in the pot as an underdog than your opponents who don't play as well as you. Therefore you will have fewer chances to give bad beats than receive them. The simple process of consciously recognizing that you will receive bad beats is the first step in handling them well.
Often a bad beat or two in a short time is a good excuse to take a break. Remember that poker is a lifelong game and there will be another hand dealt when you get back. Missing a few hands or even a few hours can be beneficial. Often a breath of fresh air and a short walk will do wonders for your frame of mind.
Make a conscious decision to tighten up your starting hand requirements for a few rounds. If playing hold 'em, play only aces, kings, queens, and ace-king. This will guarantee that you will not be playing many hands for a few rounds and will only let you enter the pot with a strong hand. What will happen most times is you will play no hands except your big blind and this will give you time to start thinking correctly again.
Short bouts of tilt are least harmful in limit poker. If playing pot-limit or no-limit, even a short stint of tilt can put a large dent in your bankroll or eliminate you from a tournament. For this reason, when playing pot-limit or no-limit, I strongly suggest a short break, or even switching to a limit game for a while if you are able.
Some players start drinking when they receive a bad beat. Do not let this be you. No matter how bad the beat was, drinking will in no way help you make the correct decisions to turn your session around.
As many before me have written, get your money in with the best of it and over the long run you will be not only a winning player, but a profitable one too.
By Wesley Young
As many experts have said, poker is a game that must be viewed as one continuous session that lasts a lifetime. If one can keep this simple statement in mind, it can make the short-term variances, or luck, less painful when the underdog wins. Recently this point was driven home to me not once, but twice in the same night.
I often play in a local weekly no-limit Texas hold 'em tournament and the following two hands came up involving my wife and me. Just before I left, she decided to play in her first poker tournament and went with me. She was very nervous and I told her to play like she had learned and not like Gus Hansen. As it turned out, she lasted longer than I did and just missed the money. She played tight and aggressive and got all in with the odds in her favor when it mattered.
The first hand to discuss is the one that knocked me out. I was under the gun and had about 900 chips left. (The average was 1,500.) When I looked down and saw pocket aces, I decided to move all in, as I had built a rather loose image and felt one of the large stacks would try to keep me honest. Well, I got my wish. A very solid player in middle position raised all-in for about 500 more to isolate me, and we had no other takers. When he turned over ace-king off suit I was elated. This made me over 92 percent to double up.
Of course, if my aces had held up you wouldn't be reading about it here. After all of the burns and turns the board read Q, T, 6, T, J giving him a straight and me a seat on the sidelines.
The next hand is the one that knocked my wife out. It was down to four players and she and the other middle-sized stack both got all in before the flop. She had ace-king offsuit against his ace-eight suited, which made her a 69 percent favorite. After the flop came K, T, 9 rainbow she was 91 percent to win. The turn was a six and the river was a seven, giving him a straight and her a place beside me. She would have been the chip leader and in the money if she would have won that hand.
Some people would whine about both of these as being bad beats and act like the cards owed them something. The way I choose to look at these situations is a little different, and helps keep me focused and off tilt. If I'm a 95 percent favorite and the 5 percent wins, then I feel that the next time I'll be a 96 percent favorite because I know that I'll win 95 out of 100 times and I've already used up one of the losses. I also know that if I continue to strive to put myself in these situations, I will be successful.
Of course this is not the only method one can use to avoid tilt. Here are some suggestions and methods that work for some players. The most important thing is to have a plan in place ahead of time. So find something that works for you and your game and stick with it.
Understand that you will receive bad beats as a poker player. As a matter of fact you will receive more bad beats, as you become a better player. This is because you will be less likely to get your money in the pot as an underdog than your opponents who don't play as well as you. Therefore you will have fewer chances to give bad beats than receive them. The simple process of consciously recognizing that you will receive bad beats is the first step in handling them well.
Often a bad beat or two in a short time is a good excuse to take a break. Remember that poker is a lifelong game and there will be another hand dealt when you get back. Missing a few hands or even a few hours can be beneficial. Often a breath of fresh air and a short walk will do wonders for your frame of mind.
Make a conscious decision to tighten up your starting hand requirements for a few rounds. If playing hold 'em, play only aces, kings, queens, and ace-king. This will guarantee that you will not be playing many hands for a few rounds and will only let you enter the pot with a strong hand. What will happen most times is you will play no hands except your big blind and this will give you time to start thinking correctly again.
Short bouts of tilt are least harmful in limit poker. If playing pot-limit or no-limit, even a short stint of tilt can put a large dent in your bankroll or eliminate you from a tournament. For this reason, when playing pot-limit or no-limit, I strongly suggest a short break, or even switching to a limit game for a while if you are able.
Some players start drinking when they receive a bad beat. Do not let this be you. No matter how bad the beat was, drinking will in no way help you make the correct decisions to turn your session around.
As many before me have written, get your money in with the best of it and over the long run you will be not only a winning player, but a profitable one too.
Getting Paid Off Huge: Optimal Play at Low Stakes Internet No-Limit Hold-Em
By David Sillers
It is clear that the goal of the majority who read www.twoplustwo.com and the books by Two Plus Two Publishing is to make the most money possible at any particular level. For those who are just starting the game and those who are looking to build a bankroll, low stakes no-limit hold 'em can be the most profitable game on the Internet. While games such as Party Poker's $25 ($.25/$.50 blinds) and $50 ($.5/1 blinds) capped no-limit games are easy to make money in simply because of the awful play of the opponents, practically all players (even those on www.twoplustwo.com) play far from optimally at these stakes. The primary reasons for this is that they over-emphasize "deception" and create a mental constraint on their betting due to the pot sizes present.
The deception usually involves slow-playing, which is almost always a disaster at these limits. It is more important to build a large pot with hands that you want to be all-in with by the river than it is to deceive anyone. This article will suggest adjustments to low-stakes no-limit style and the reasons present for each adjustment.
Deception in one's play style is a critical aspect of high-stakes and tournament play, but has far diminished value in these low stakes games simply because the average opponent does not think deeply enough about the game to really be deceived. In order for a "deceptive" play to be correct, it must cause the opponent to make a mistake that is more profitable for you than his play is if he had not been deceived.
The classic example of this is checking a set in early position into a pre-flop raiser in order to feign weakness. At low-stakes no-limit, this is almost never the correct play. It is almost always better to simply bet and hope for a raise than to slow play, because you will pot commit the opponent early in the hand and let him blast out any possible draws for you. If you can get a one-pair hand to raise your set, which is the "nuts" on almost all flops (sets will be ahead by the end of almost all hands completed on the flop), then you are both protecting your own hand and getting more money in the pot to prepare for your all-in. You don't have that many streets to get the entire stack in the middle, and at these games slow-playing is almost always a catastrophic mistake.
Note that this also rings true for "advertising" plays, which lose practically all value when the opponents either do not understand or do not care what you are trying to advertise. At the lower limits both are usually true.
Another critical aspect of playing optimally in these games is taking advantage of the widely held notion that poker is somehow a test of manliness, a view which is propped up by the popularity of poker broadcasting.
Poor players often seem to interpret big bets or raises as a personal insult to their poker ego, and find all kinds of excuses to call. They generally do not want to lay down hands and are immediately suspicious of large bets, causing them to call far too much. This propensity of low-stakes players to call bets that are far out of line with the pot size often makes traditional "value betting" inferior to over-betting when you have an edge. Here are some examples in which over-betting has worked especially well for me:
When you get a great hand in the small blind and over-bet the pot into the big blind and any limpers. The big blind will often think you are leaning on him and min-raise you, or actually raise the new pot. This is great when you have a premium hand like ace-king or a pair of jacks or better and are willing to get it all-in (against what is essentially a random hand) before the flop. This is really the best way to build a pot with a great hand from the small blind. If you just complete to deceive them, the pot will be so small they won't fight for it on the flop. This also works from the big blind.
On the end when you have the nuts or are sure you are ahead, betting big is often the play with the highest value. The percentage that a worse hand will call you multiplied by the amount of the bet is the expected value of any "value" bet, but no one ever said that the bet with the highest expected value had to be small. Against many opponents it's better to bet $15 instead of $5 into a $10 pot. Making a traditional value bet in a small pot in PP low stakes is often not as profitable as over-betting, because of the percentage of the time that someone will talk themselves into a call.
The ultimate incarnation of the "poker ego" play is what my friend Adam Rothman introduced to me as the "move of honor." The move is simply open pushing with aces or kings pre-flop, regardless of the previous action. While this may sound absurd, the rate that someone will call you is surprisingly high, and the potential payoff is huge. When you can get an edge as big as 4-to-1 pre-flop for all your money, it is a crime not to take it.
This is only scratching the surface of what is possible at low stakes no limit hold 'em, but hopefully it will cause players to realize some of the mistakes that may have been causing them to play sub-optimally in the past. By causing weak opponents to make large mistakes when you have a significant edge, you can achieve one of the highest win-rates at any stakes in gambling
By David Sillers
It is clear that the goal of the majority who read www.twoplustwo.com and the books by Two Plus Two Publishing is to make the most money possible at any particular level. For those who are just starting the game and those who are looking to build a bankroll, low stakes no-limit hold 'em can be the most profitable game on the Internet. While games such as Party Poker's $25 ($.25/$.50 blinds) and $50 ($.5/1 blinds) capped no-limit games are easy to make money in simply because of the awful play of the opponents, practically all players (even those on www.twoplustwo.com) play far from optimally at these stakes. The primary reasons for this is that they over-emphasize "deception" and create a mental constraint on their betting due to the pot sizes present.
The deception usually involves slow-playing, which is almost always a disaster at these limits. It is more important to build a large pot with hands that you want to be all-in with by the river than it is to deceive anyone. This article will suggest adjustments to low-stakes no-limit style and the reasons present for each adjustment.
Deception in one's play style is a critical aspect of high-stakes and tournament play, but has far diminished value in these low stakes games simply because the average opponent does not think deeply enough about the game to really be deceived. In order for a "deceptive" play to be correct, it must cause the opponent to make a mistake that is more profitable for you than his play is if he had not been deceived.
The classic example of this is checking a set in early position into a pre-flop raiser in order to feign weakness. At low-stakes no-limit, this is almost never the correct play. It is almost always better to simply bet and hope for a raise than to slow play, because you will pot commit the opponent early in the hand and let him blast out any possible draws for you. If you can get a one-pair hand to raise your set, which is the "nuts" on almost all flops (sets will be ahead by the end of almost all hands completed on the flop), then you are both protecting your own hand and getting more money in the pot to prepare for your all-in. You don't have that many streets to get the entire stack in the middle, and at these games slow-playing is almost always a catastrophic mistake.
Note that this also rings true for "advertising" plays, which lose practically all value when the opponents either do not understand or do not care what you are trying to advertise. At the lower limits both are usually true.
Another critical aspect of playing optimally in these games is taking advantage of the widely held notion that poker is somehow a test of manliness, a view which is propped up by the popularity of poker broadcasting.
Poor players often seem to interpret big bets or raises as a personal insult to their poker ego, and find all kinds of excuses to call. They generally do not want to lay down hands and are immediately suspicious of large bets, causing them to call far too much. This propensity of low-stakes players to call bets that are far out of line with the pot size often makes traditional "value betting" inferior to over-betting when you have an edge. Here are some examples in which over-betting has worked especially well for me:
When you get a great hand in the small blind and over-bet the pot into the big blind and any limpers. The big blind will often think you are leaning on him and min-raise you, or actually raise the new pot. This is great when you have a premium hand like ace-king or a pair of jacks or better and are willing to get it all-in (against what is essentially a random hand) before the flop. This is really the best way to build a pot with a great hand from the small blind. If you just complete to deceive them, the pot will be so small they won't fight for it on the flop. This also works from the big blind.
On the end when you have the nuts or are sure you are ahead, betting big is often the play with the highest value. The percentage that a worse hand will call you multiplied by the amount of the bet is the expected value of any "value" bet, but no one ever said that the bet with the highest expected value had to be small. Against many opponents it's better to bet $15 instead of $5 into a $10 pot. Making a traditional value bet in a small pot in PP low stakes is often not as profitable as over-betting, because of the percentage of the time that someone will talk themselves into a call.
The ultimate incarnation of the "poker ego" play is what my friend Adam Rothman introduced to me as the "move of honor." The move is simply open pushing with aces or kings pre-flop, regardless of the previous action. While this may sound absurd, the rate that someone will call you is surprisingly high, and the potential payoff is huge. When you can get an edge as big as 4-to-1 pre-flop for all your money, it is a crime not to take it.
This is only scratching the surface of what is possible at low stakes no limit hold 'em, but hopefully it will cause players to realize some of the mistakes that may have been causing them to play sub-optimally in the past. By causing weak opponents to make large mistakes when you have a significant edge, you can achieve one of the highest win-rates at any stakes in gambling
Stepping Out of the House -- Tips on Playing Live Poker for the First Time
By Scott Armstrong
The explosion of the Internet throughout the last decade has presented a multitude of interesting ways for humans to eliminate the need for social interaction altogether. From grocery shopping, to movie watching, to even dating, the Internet provides many outlets to live your life without ever leaving your home (or parent's basement).
This phenomenon has certainly helped fuel the explosion of poker throughout the world. Aspiring poker pros have access to any number of games online at all times of the day. Hundreds of thousands of hands can be played in mere months, meaning it's possible to gain years of experience in this wondrous game without ever setting foot in a casino.
A casino? What's that? Well, many online pros might be surprised to know that people do still play poker outside of their homes. It's true! With real cards and chips and everything!
Seriously though, Internet players and beginners who are making their first trek to a "brick and mortar" casino will find many challenges as they adapt to the differences of live play. And regardless of how many $15-$30 hands you've logged online, there are some do's and don'ts to remember to keep you from looking like a $2-$4 rookie when you play live for the first time. Here are a few ways to make that first trip to the poker room a successful one:
Do take time to scope out the room before playing. There's a reason most poker players remember the first time they ever walk into a casino. It's a bit overwhelming -- the lights, sounds, and sights -- and can be a lot to absorb. Same goes for the poker room. While it's tempting to jump immediately into a game, take some time to check out the room. Watch the action at a few tables to see how the players act when making bets and raises. Get familiar with the board that lists the different games being spread. Read the house rules regarding rake levels, jackpot qualifications, and bad beat bonuses (if there are any). And find the nearest restroom. Spending just a few minutes getting comfortable will make it easier to ease into your game of choice.
Don't be a nit. A "nit" is essentially someone who feels it's their duty to remind the rest of the table each time they make a mistake of any sort. It might be anything from harping on a particular rule, berating a player for acting out of turn, or making critical comments about the way a player played a hand. First, regardless of how long you've played poker, you don't know it all. Many people are there to have a good time and being a nit is an easy way to put the table in a bad mood, limiting action from the loose players you're going to make your money off of.
If there's a rule you feel has been violated, simply ask the dealer to call over the floor person. It's their job to solve disputes -- not yours.
Do ask questions. If you're confused about something, ask a dealer or a floor person. There's nothing embarrassing about asking a question. What's worse, asking a silly question, or losing a number of bets or a whole pot because you didn't understand a rule or acted incorrectly?
Don't make a string bet. A string bet is a bet where you make an action that looks like a call, before going back to your stack to make a raise. For example, let's say you have aces on the button in a $3-$6 game. There are three limpers to you and you want to raise. If you place three $1 chips out ahead of you and then reach back to grab three more chips, this will likely be called a string bet. The rule is in place so you can't try to gain information from the rest of the table before you raise -- like saying "I call your $3," and watching the rest of the table's reaction to your call before saying "and I raise you another $3."
There are two easy ways to generally avoid making a string bet. One is to grab a big enough stack of chips to easily place your bet and raise out in front of you in one smooth motion. This is something you can practice at home. Another way to avoid a string bet is to make a clear verbal declaration before you bet. Simply say "Raise" or "I raise". That way if you happen to not grab enough chips, or knock over one of your stacks, your raise still stands up.
Getting called for a string bet is bad for two reasons -- you've announced to the table that you like your hand, but you're not allowed to get more money into the pot so you're losing equity.
Do cap your cards in front of your chips. When you're in a hand, you'll want to make sure to keep your cards face down and visible to the rest of the table. The easiest way to do this is to put your cards in clear view in front of your chips, topped off with a chip, coin, or other trinket. This helps other players see whether you're still in the hand and keeps the play in turn.
Another reason to cap your cards is to prevent them from being folded. If you don't cap your cards, the dealer can easily read them as being folded -- and the last thing you want is the dealer to sweep your nut flush into the muck because you didn't protect your cards correctly. Once your cards are in the muck there's very little recourse. Always protect your cards.
Don't act out of turn. While it's tempting to auto-fold your nine-five off-suit the fifth time in a row that you've been dealt it, make sure to wait until it's your play to do so. This seems elementary, but if you're not paying attention to the action it's very easy to fold out of turn. Besides drawing the ire of other players, remember you're giving an unfair advantage to those who you acted before -- they now know you are going to fold, which gives them additional information before acting.
Do learn to keep track of the pot size. Calculating pot odds is a breeze online because the pot size is clearly displayed on the table. This isn't the case in a B&M casino. It'll only take one hand where you have a questionable call on the flop or turn and realize you only see a huge pile of chips and there doesn't happen to be a number floating above it, before you wish you had remembered to keep track of the pot size.
Practice counting the bets in the hands that you're not involved in. Come up with your own system that you're comfortable with to keep track of the pot size. It'll come in handy when you have a tricky pot odds decision and will keep the game moving at a quicker pace too.
Don't talk strategy at the table. There's just no need to educate the guy at the other end of the table who's explaining his theory on why low cards are better to play because there's more of them in the deck. Correcting his flawed theories, or anyone else's, has a number of negative effects.
Many casinos frown upon players talking about specific hands while there is a hand in play.
Showing off your broad knowledge of poker is a quick way to make others less likely to tangle with you if they realize you're a solid thinker and player.
Your "educating" of another player may just make them feel stupid, which in turn might lead them to take their money -- and your potential profits -- to another table or casino.
You've likely heard the phrase "don't tap the aquarium" when it comes to online players. You don't want to scare away the fish. Same goes for live play as well.
I'll be the first to admit it can be difficult to hold your tongue sometimes, which leads me to my next point...
Do be ready to take some vicious bad beats. The first time B&M player will be quite surprised to see the level of play in a casino is usually poorer than expected for most low to mid-level games. From my experience, winning $1-$2 or even $.50-$1 online players are perfectly capable of playing in $4-$8 games or even higher.
And while the soft level of play is good for your long term bankroll, be ready to expect some pretty tough beats. Online it can be easy to cuss out "Eric2468" when he hits a two-outer on the river and hurl your mouse across the room. You pick up and move on. It can be a lot harder to take when you see the player sitting right across from you, stacking your chips.
The live element of taking a bad beat, combined with the likelihood that the size of the pot is larger than your usual online stakes, can easily put someone on tilt. If you experience a really tough loss, don't be afraid to take a time out from the table. Go get a drink of water, or hit the bathroom. Walk around the casino a bit while you cool off. Your bankroll will thank you for it.
Don't forget that tipping is appreciated. Tipping, while not mandatory, is a good way to reward dealers who do their job quickly and effectively. Unfortunately, much like eating in a restaurant, you'll encounter bad service at the tables as well. If a dealer is doing a terrible job -- not paying attention to the action, exposing the next card before betting is complete, or being rude to the players -- don't feel compelled to tip when you take down a pot. Tipping is a reward for good service at the table, not an obligation to the player.
And finally...
Do remember to have fun! Poker is the greatest gambling game in the world. There may be a lot of cash at stake, but in the end most people are there to have fun. If you get into the flow and take time to enjoy yourself and share some laughs with your table, your first live casino experience will be one that you'll always remember -- win or lose. (But hopefully win!)
By Scott Armstrong
The explosion of the Internet throughout the last decade has presented a multitude of interesting ways for humans to eliminate the need for social interaction altogether. From grocery shopping, to movie watching, to even dating, the Internet provides many outlets to live your life without ever leaving your home (or parent's basement).
This phenomenon has certainly helped fuel the explosion of poker throughout the world. Aspiring poker pros have access to any number of games online at all times of the day. Hundreds of thousands of hands can be played in mere months, meaning it's possible to gain years of experience in this wondrous game without ever setting foot in a casino.
A casino? What's that? Well, many online pros might be surprised to know that people do still play poker outside of their homes. It's true! With real cards and chips and everything!
Seriously though, Internet players and beginners who are making their first trek to a "brick and mortar" casino will find many challenges as they adapt to the differences of live play. And regardless of how many $15-$30 hands you've logged online, there are some do's and don'ts to remember to keep you from looking like a $2-$4 rookie when you play live for the first time. Here are a few ways to make that first trip to the poker room a successful one:
Do take time to scope out the room before playing. There's a reason most poker players remember the first time they ever walk into a casino. It's a bit overwhelming -- the lights, sounds, and sights -- and can be a lot to absorb. Same goes for the poker room. While it's tempting to jump immediately into a game, take some time to check out the room. Watch the action at a few tables to see how the players act when making bets and raises. Get familiar with the board that lists the different games being spread. Read the house rules regarding rake levels, jackpot qualifications, and bad beat bonuses (if there are any). And find the nearest restroom. Spending just a few minutes getting comfortable will make it easier to ease into your game of choice.
Don't be a nit. A "nit" is essentially someone who feels it's their duty to remind the rest of the table each time they make a mistake of any sort. It might be anything from harping on a particular rule, berating a player for acting out of turn, or making critical comments about the way a player played a hand. First, regardless of how long you've played poker, you don't know it all. Many people are there to have a good time and being a nit is an easy way to put the table in a bad mood, limiting action from the loose players you're going to make your money off of.
If there's a rule you feel has been violated, simply ask the dealer to call over the floor person. It's their job to solve disputes -- not yours.
Do ask questions. If you're confused about something, ask a dealer or a floor person. There's nothing embarrassing about asking a question. What's worse, asking a silly question, or losing a number of bets or a whole pot because you didn't understand a rule or acted incorrectly?
Don't make a string bet. A string bet is a bet where you make an action that looks like a call, before going back to your stack to make a raise. For example, let's say you have aces on the button in a $3-$6 game. There are three limpers to you and you want to raise. If you place three $1 chips out ahead of you and then reach back to grab three more chips, this will likely be called a string bet. The rule is in place so you can't try to gain information from the rest of the table before you raise -- like saying "I call your $3," and watching the rest of the table's reaction to your call before saying "and I raise you another $3."
There are two easy ways to generally avoid making a string bet. One is to grab a big enough stack of chips to easily place your bet and raise out in front of you in one smooth motion. This is something you can practice at home. Another way to avoid a string bet is to make a clear verbal declaration before you bet. Simply say "Raise" or "I raise". That way if you happen to not grab enough chips, or knock over one of your stacks, your raise still stands up.
Getting called for a string bet is bad for two reasons -- you've announced to the table that you like your hand, but you're not allowed to get more money into the pot so you're losing equity.
Do cap your cards in front of your chips. When you're in a hand, you'll want to make sure to keep your cards face down and visible to the rest of the table. The easiest way to do this is to put your cards in clear view in front of your chips, topped off with a chip, coin, or other trinket. This helps other players see whether you're still in the hand and keeps the play in turn.
Another reason to cap your cards is to prevent them from being folded. If you don't cap your cards, the dealer can easily read them as being folded -- and the last thing you want is the dealer to sweep your nut flush into the muck because you didn't protect your cards correctly. Once your cards are in the muck there's very little recourse. Always protect your cards.
Don't act out of turn. While it's tempting to auto-fold your nine-five off-suit the fifth time in a row that you've been dealt it, make sure to wait until it's your play to do so. This seems elementary, but if you're not paying attention to the action it's very easy to fold out of turn. Besides drawing the ire of other players, remember you're giving an unfair advantage to those who you acted before -- they now know you are going to fold, which gives them additional information before acting.
Do learn to keep track of the pot size. Calculating pot odds is a breeze online because the pot size is clearly displayed on the table. This isn't the case in a B&M casino. It'll only take one hand where you have a questionable call on the flop or turn and realize you only see a huge pile of chips and there doesn't happen to be a number floating above it, before you wish you had remembered to keep track of the pot size.
Practice counting the bets in the hands that you're not involved in. Come up with your own system that you're comfortable with to keep track of the pot size. It'll come in handy when you have a tricky pot odds decision and will keep the game moving at a quicker pace too.
Don't talk strategy at the table. There's just no need to educate the guy at the other end of the table who's explaining his theory on why low cards are better to play because there's more of them in the deck. Correcting his flawed theories, or anyone else's, has a number of negative effects.
Many casinos frown upon players talking about specific hands while there is a hand in play.
Showing off your broad knowledge of poker is a quick way to make others less likely to tangle with you if they realize you're a solid thinker and player.
Your "educating" of another player may just make them feel stupid, which in turn might lead them to take their money -- and your potential profits -- to another table or casino.
You've likely heard the phrase "don't tap the aquarium" when it comes to online players. You don't want to scare away the fish. Same goes for live play as well.
I'll be the first to admit it can be difficult to hold your tongue sometimes, which leads me to my next point...
Do be ready to take some vicious bad beats. The first time B&M player will be quite surprised to see the level of play in a casino is usually poorer than expected for most low to mid-level games. From my experience, winning $1-$2 or even $.50-$1 online players are perfectly capable of playing in $4-$8 games or even higher.
And while the soft level of play is good for your long term bankroll, be ready to expect some pretty tough beats. Online it can be easy to cuss out "Eric2468" when he hits a two-outer on the river and hurl your mouse across the room. You pick up and move on. It can be a lot harder to take when you see the player sitting right across from you, stacking your chips.
The live element of taking a bad beat, combined with the likelihood that the size of the pot is larger than your usual online stakes, can easily put someone on tilt. If you experience a really tough loss, don't be afraid to take a time out from the table. Go get a drink of water, or hit the bathroom. Walk around the casino a bit while you cool off. Your bankroll will thank you for it.
Don't forget that tipping is appreciated. Tipping, while not mandatory, is a good way to reward dealers who do their job quickly and effectively. Unfortunately, much like eating in a restaurant, you'll encounter bad service at the tables as well. If a dealer is doing a terrible job -- not paying attention to the action, exposing the next card before betting is complete, or being rude to the players -- don't feel compelled to tip when you take down a pot. Tipping is a reward for good service at the table, not an obligation to the player.
And finally...
Do remember to have fun! Poker is the greatest gambling game in the world. There may be a lot of cash at stake, but in the end most people are there to have fun. If you get into the flow and take time to enjoy yourself and share some laughs with your table, your first live casino experience will be one that you'll always remember -- win or lose. (But hopefully win!)
-
pennsylvania jones
- 6th Man HOF
- Posts: 7269
- Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 12:48 pm
- Location: Beast Coast
I hate whiney bitches.
So I'm at Tropics Poker in a ring game .10 15 NL
I bring fuckin $1.50 to the table ha..
I'm down to like .75
Flop comes, I'm on a spade flush draw. Dude raises .40 cents.. fuck it, I'm all in with .75 left.... wtf lol You know?
Odds aren't bad, plus look, I had .75 left. I ALL IN'd.
I won. He cries. "ALL IN ON A FLUSH DRAW.. WTF YOU IDIOT"
:::text fighting ensues::::
I leave with more of his money.
I would never ALL IN in a tourney worth a good sum of money with a freakin flush draw unless I was extremely short stacked.
I was wrong here? Nah
So I'm at Tropics Poker in a ring game .10 15 NL
I bring fuckin $1.50 to the table ha..
I'm down to like .75
Flop comes, I'm on a spade flush draw. Dude raises .40 cents.. fuck it, I'm all in with .75 left.... wtf lol You know?
Odds aren't bad, plus look, I had .75 left. I ALL IN'd.
I won. He cries. "ALL IN ON A FLUSH DRAW.. WTF YOU IDIOT"
:::text fighting ensues::::
I leave with more of his money.
I would never ALL IN in a tourney worth a good sum of money with a freakin flush draw unless I was extremely short stacked.
I was wrong here? Nah
people who play micro limits have no room to crticize anyone. LOL, i woulda done the same thing, its .75 cents. if he was that mad he didnt have to call anyway.pendiana jones wrote:I hate whiney bitches.
So I'm at Tropics Poker in a ring game .10 15 NL
I bring fuckin $1.50 to the table ha..
I'm down to like .75
Flop comes, I'm on a spade flush draw. Dude raises .40 cents.. fuck it, I'm all in with .75 left.... wtf lol You know?
Odds aren't bad, plus look, I had .75 left. I ALL IN'd.
I won. He cries. "ALL IN ON A FLUSH DRAW.. WTF YOU IDIOT"
:::text fighting ensues::::
I leave with more of his money.
I would never ALL IN in a tourney worth a good sum of money with a freakin flush draw unless I was extremely short stacked.
I was wrong here? Nah
-
pennsylvania jones
- 6th Man HOF
- Posts: 7269
- Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 12:48 pm
- Location: Beast Coast
turned out to be 5G's total, I think the winner gets a G
man I was running shit
ended up getting ousted
went all in with a Full House 8's and K's
Bitch had 4 Kings and put me out! WTF
Overall not a bad night, I started off with $50, got up to $90
then played and got delrious, ended back down to $70, still up $20 for the night and I played well enough in the tourney to get invited to the Big Freeroll
man I was running shit
ended up getting ousted
went all in with a Full House 8's and K's
Bitch had 4 Kings and put me out! WTF
Overall not a bad night, I started off with $50, got up to $90
then played and got delrious, ended back down to $70, still up $20 for the night and I played well enough in the tourney to get invited to the Big Freeroll
-
Cash Rulz
- Voice of Reason
- Posts: 13524
- Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 11:06 am
- Location: Your girl's house
- Contact:
Last night, I just won a poker tournament here in ATL. It was the first round and the winner of the second round gets to play for a $10,000 seat at the 2005 WSOP.
Wish me luck. It was my first tournament ever and I kicked ass and I think thanks alot to these reads.
With that being said, no Wiper, if I win I will not share shit.
Thank you.
Wish me luck. It was my first tournament ever and I kicked ass and I think thanks alot to these reads.
With that being said, no Wiper, if I win I will not share shit.
Thank you.
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pennsylvania jones
- 6th Man HOF
- Posts: 7269
- Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 12:48 pm
- Location: Beast Coast
-
Cash Rulz
- Voice of Reason
- Posts: 13524
- Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 11:06 am
- Location: Your girl's house
- Contact:
No buy-in. It was out of 42 people. The 23rd I'm going to the second round. I really didn't know this was the prize. I've never been in a tournament so I just wanted to find a free one that I could test my skills at and got lucky. Yeah, this was offline. At a restaurant. Atlanta has some sort of tournament going on everyday I've learned. Not all have this type of prize, usually just gift certificates and material prizes and shit.
Wiper, I'm fuckin' with you. (well not really, in that I wouldn't share, but i was being funny, lol)
Wiper, I'm fuckin' with you. (well not really, in that I wouldn't share, but i was being funny, lol)
i'd say look for places that just started up. i just looked at this new site called checkandraise.comMoe Cheeks wrote:anyone know of any poker places to join where you can deposit under $50 to start
and the funny thing is they only haad 150 players for their freeroll. :shock:
anyway, if your looking to play more than just tourney i would deposit more than $50 cuz that not enough to play .25/.50 limit with a bankroll. just some advice
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pennsylvania jones
- 6th Man HOF
- Posts: 7269
- Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 12:48 pm
- Location: Beast Coast
Very few sites let you dep with less than 50. Most sites that are 50 min do come with decent depo bonuses. (hint, nudge, like the ones linked on my site :) ).
If you can, and you're just starting, set like 300 aside. Play with that, and use it to chase bonuses on the different Party skins. (Empire, Party, Pokernow, Eurobet). You can make some decent extra money just by "bonus whoring". If you're playing a lot, and and higher limits- something called "rakeback" will be nicer for you than bonuses- get at me via pm if that's something you're interested in.
If you can, and you're just starting, set like 300 aside. Play with that, and use it to chase bonuses on the different Party skins. (Empire, Party, Pokernow, Eurobet). You can make some decent extra money just by "bonus whoring". If you're playing a lot, and and higher limits- something called "rakeback" will be nicer for you than bonuses- get at me via pm if that's something you're interested in.
So this was my week.
Party sends me 50 bucks for free, one of those "you used to play here a lot please play more" things. They want me to play 500 raked hands to cash it out. 50 isn't enough for me to grind out playing the lowest limits.
So instead I've got to double that (min cashout at Party is $50).
I go to 50NL and move all in on the first good hand I've got (A6s, on a board where I had a flush draw and middle pair). I made my flush (and was all in against a guy with the same flush draw anyway). Double up- cash 50 out.
So I've still got 50 there, I play a $50 SNG. I win that- $200 profit, cash THAT out.
Then Party's Bad Beat Jackpot gets high, and my friend SpicyF stakes me to play here (basically he gives me $200, I play 2/4 with it and keep 80% of my winnings, and if I happen to get a BBJ payout, he gets 80% of that). I win about $75 doing that.
At the same time as the BBJ stuff, Party has these step tournaments. You buy in at a level and if you place high enough in that, you move up to the next. The final step is a $1000 SNG. I buy in at the $50 level, and place high enough in steps2, 3 and 4 to end up in the step 5.
I win THAT. BOOM. 4.5K payoff. A nice week of cashing out 4825 on an initial investment of zero. (which is nice, 'cause it means I don't have to take the loan I just was approved for on Friday).
Party sends me 50 bucks for free, one of those "you used to play here a lot please play more" things. They want me to play 500 raked hands to cash it out. 50 isn't enough for me to grind out playing the lowest limits.
So instead I've got to double that (min cashout at Party is $50).
I go to 50NL and move all in on the first good hand I've got (A6s, on a board where I had a flush draw and middle pair). I made my flush (and was all in against a guy with the same flush draw anyway). Double up- cash 50 out.
So I've still got 50 there, I play a $50 SNG. I win that- $200 profit, cash THAT out.
Then Party's Bad Beat Jackpot gets high, and my friend SpicyF stakes me to play here (basically he gives me $200, I play 2/4 with it and keep 80% of my winnings, and if I happen to get a BBJ payout, he gets 80% of that). I win about $75 doing that.
At the same time as the BBJ stuff, Party has these step tournaments. You buy in at a level and if you place high enough in that, you move up to the next. The final step is a $1000 SNG. I buy in at the $50 level, and place high enough in steps2, 3 and 4 to end up in the step 5.
I win THAT. BOOM. 4.5K payoff. A nice week of cashing out 4825 on an initial investment of zero. (which is nice, 'cause it means I don't have to take the loan I just was approved for on Friday).