I Wish...

[Thun]

... that Big L, OC, and the Artifacts dropped their debut albums circa '92, in the style that is witnessed on their demos. Their material that came out in '94/'95 was great, obviously, but conforms so much to the times with all the slower tempo and/or darker, moodier songs. These guys had already mastered a more energetic 92 flavor and it would have been amazing if they had gotten that material out in an official format.

Add on. Let's make this a multi-pager that we can transfer to the blog and get the whole world adding to.

[godmc]

i've always wondered what a beatnuts album might sound like had they dropped one a couple years earlier. they had a lot of funky sounds on their debut, but like you said... it had a darker/downtempo feel to it (and i loved it) but i'm curious to know what some earlier tracks from them would have sounded like [probably something in the vein of cypress hill's debut, musically].

[godmc]

i should also not that their '93 ep and single doesn't really satisfy me as an example - they still had that downtempo sound; and i think there was a megashift in sound from '92 to '93 across the board.

[aleph]

This thread could make Big Baby Jesus cry.

On the subject of J-Treds, why didn't dude drop a few singles/demos from the Peace Of Mind/Recognize era (94ish), then parlay that into an album? He's the only Indelible MC that didn't (I don't count BMS), and it would have been just as fiyyaah as the other two. I prefer his early raw style to his more polished rhymes circa Make It Happen, not to mention the ill Juggaknots/El-P production vs. the more conventional Kan & Supe beats (nice as they are).

Didn't the Indelibles plan a posse album sometime in the late 90s? On the strength of Fire In Which You Burn and Weight that would have been some phenomenal shit.

:big sigh:

[Thirteen]

Now that you say it that shit about Big L is right, no wonder why I only listen to a handful of songs on lifestyles, and would rather listen to his freestyles.

and did beatnuts put out anything before said conformity?

[aREAL]

Word Thun. I've been thinking the same.

[aleph]

...this came to pass.

Paul C was studying N.W.A.'s Straight Outta Compton when he was getting ready to work with Rakim. One day Stezo partner Chris Lowe was over at Paul C's house checking out records. "I looked out the window and Rakim pulled up in a white Mercedes with a Louis Vuitton top. I was like, Oh shit, it's about to be on!"

"Just before he passed, I know Paul and Rakim were getting close," remembers Large Professor. "I would be over at Paul's house and hear the messages from Ra. I was like wow, he's getting ready to get busy with Eric B & Rakim."

Paul would call CJ Moore and audition beats he wanted to use. "I wanted to get on that project," smiles CJ. "I think Paul's wife was friends with Rakim's girl and they were introduced that way. I gave Paul a Steely Dan record we were going to use with Rakim. I was like, 'You can just play that shit over.' So (Paul) played the bass over the phone ג€“ that's when I noticed just how gifted he was. It was the way he played. A lot of records we sampled aren't jamming records. There were simple lines. But it was about how long you held the note, how you plucked it, how you approached it with velocity. Paul C understood how what we sampled was played."

Everybody he worked with, from Mikey D to Rahzel to Monch, remembers Paul C chomping at the chance to match his beats with the appropriate lyrical arsenal. The R stood between the cue of the record and the "S" on any MC's soon-to-be-deflated chessst. For production ideas, Paul C makes tapes for Rakim and they build over then-unknown funk gems like Funk Inc., 24 Carat Black and Tony Avlon.

(Source: http://blogs.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuse ... =301888715 )

EDIT: I know Large Professor basically picked up where Paul left off so what we have is a kind of reconstruction or the next best thing.

Allegedly Latifah was next. Might have meant I would be listening to Nature Of A Sista today.

And I too, agree with the first wish. Can you imagine a 92 OC lp with tracks in the vein of the og Step Into The O-Zone?

[strategy786]

Interesting thought Thun. I gotta go back and take some listens...

For conversation's sake, it might be good for someone to post some of those demos (Big L, OC, and the Artifacts) right in this thread.

[siderealist]

Definitely feel this thread... Early 90s hip-hop had a different feel.
94 and on was darker and focused more on basslines.

[TheBigSleep]

... that Big L, OC, and the Artifacts dropped their debut albums circa '92, in the style that is witnessed on their demos. Their material that came out in '94/'95 was great, obviously, but conforms so much to the times with all the slower tempo and/or darker, moodier songs. These guys had already mastered a more energetic 92 flavor and it would have been amazing if they had gotten that material out in an official format.

Add on. Let's make this a multi-pager that we can transfer to the blog and get the whole world adding to.

In L's case (and probably for the others too) it wasn't for lack of trying. L was really attempting to get his debut out starting in '93 (after getting signed the same day as but just before NaS in late '92) and definitely throughout '94 but Columbia wasn't havin' it, even though most of the Lifestylez songs were from that era, with only Street Struck and MVP recorded in early '95.

In fact, when he asked if he could update the beats because the label was laggin', they told him no. He was mad at the lack of marketing and promotion too.

Plus there's a bunch of unheard tracks from him from that time frame and before ('84 - '92).

A recording of him reciting some other group's rhymes (probably those of Cold Crush or Run-DMC) before he starting writing his own lyrics, sometime around age ten ('84), battle videos starting at like fifteen ('89), the Three the Hard Way / Two Hard Motherfuckers demos ('89 - '90) the original demo for Devil's Son ('92), footage at the Apollo ('92), Diamond D has about three or four L featured tracks from the time Stunts, Blunts and Hip Hop was recorded ('92), the original version of Finesse's Set It Off Troop featuring A.G. and L ('92) and of course the full studio album he recorded with Show during '91 and '92 just before he got signed.

So there's a lot of (mid to) late eighties and early nineties material that still hasn't surfaced. Not sure exactly how much more O.C. and Artifacts have left in the vaults but L's definitely still got some unreleased music.

To add on, Crustified Dibbs / R.A. the Rugged Man and Percee P both dropped albums about fifteen or twenty years after their initial hype.

[Huldrich Bullsh!t]

there exists earlier beatnuts stuff than their first EP - but only as producers. i remember a 12" with their production i think 88 or 89. maybe mc lyte?

... Ras Kass wouldve dropped an lp after soul on ice 97-98 with the DITC producers
we'll i even wish he'd focus and drop an album now with someone overseeing

the golden state warriors wouldve made an album

this flood hadn't destroyed the original method man tical instrumentals

INS wouldve dropped a solo much earlier like the other first wave of solos with RZA handling the production some Wu features and maybe U-God a sspecial guest not as heavy as ghost on OB4CL but on a few of the tracks

[Verge]

there exists earlier beatnuts stuff than their first EP - but only as producers.

http://www.undergroundhiphop.com/store/ ... C=OLU005LP
http://showmethebesthiphop.blogspot.com ... -2009.html

I co-sign most everything in this thread so far and really can't add on yet, without turning this into another "I wish this album dropped then or this one didn't get shelved" thread.

[godmc]

the beatnuts produced chi-ali's album (awesome production), but fuck chi-ali... i wanna hear the beatnuts rhyming. although, they did have that grimy theme going on with heidi hoe on common's debut.

[paul_smith]

well, obviously Jay-Z's '93-'94 style over Ski and Clark Kent production would've been awesome

another mention would probably be Cormega with his style from his first 2 appearances on wax, not that I don't like his post '96 style, I love it, but the earlier was on some Nasty Nas type rhyme schemes (I always say Cormega and Tragedy had a BIG influence on him).I even read somewhere that Cormega recorded with Marley Marl in the early 90s for a solo album but the material was shelved due to him being incarcerated or some other reason

[Thun]

http://www.thetroyblog.com/2010/11/12/h ... -if-onlys/

[Huldrich Bullsh!t]

there exists earlier beatnuts stuff than their first EP - but only as producers.

http://www.undergroundhiphop.com/store/ ... C=OLU005LP
http://showmethebesthiphop.blogspot.com ... -2009.html

I co-sign most everything in this thread so far and really can't add on yet, without turning this into another "I wish this album dropped then or this one didn't get shelved" thread.

cool. wasnt aware of that though and therefore not speaking of this.
im 100% sure ive seen a 12" (and i think it was Mc Lyte) from before their Demons EP where they handled the production or did a remix.

[Thun]

there exists earlier beatnuts stuff than their first EP - but only as producers.

http://www.undergroundhiphop.com/store/ ... C=OLU005LP
http://showmethebesthiphop.blogspot.com ... -2009.html

I co-sign most everything in this thread so far and really can't add on yet, without turning this into another "I wish this album dropped then or this one didn't get shelved" thread.

cool. wasnt aware of that though and therefore not speaking of this.
im 100% sure ive seen a 12" (and i think it was Mc Lyte) from before their Demons EP where they handled the production or did a remix.

Ruffneck remix

[CRASH DDZ]

I wish I was a little but taller, I wish I was a baller...

[thomasv]

another mention would probably be Cormega with his style from his first 2 appearances on wax, not that I don't like his post '96 style, I love it, but the earlier was on some Nasty Nas type rhyme schemes (I always say Cormega and Tragedy had a BIG influence on him).I even read somewhere that Cormega recorded with Marley Marl in the early 90s for a solo album but the material was shelved due to him being incarcerated or some other reason

Don't You mean Nas and Cormega were influenced by Tragedy? Listen to Live Motivator on Marley's In Control. Then Cormega on PHD's album, and Nas on Live @BBQ.

[Thirteen]

if that bit about cormega and marley marl is true, that is a wish

[Krisch]

there exists earlier beatnuts stuff than their first EP - but only as producers.

http://www.undergroundhiphop.com/store/ ... C=OLU005LP
http://showmethebesthiphop.blogspot.com ... -2009.html

I co-sign most everything in this thread so far and really can't add on yet, without turning this into another "I wish this album dropped then or this one didn't get shelved" thread.

cool. wasnt aware of that though and therefore not speaking of this.
im 100% sure ive seen a 12" (and i think it was Mc Lyte) from before their Demons EP where they handled the production or did a remix.

Ruffneck remix

But Ruffneck was 93. They did a remix for Shazzy in 1990 and also did production for the first Monie Love album (uncredited though)

[Krisch]

INS wouldve dropped a solo much earlier like the other first wave of solos with RZA handling the production some Wu features and maybe U-God a sspecial guest not as heavy as ghost on OB4CL but on a few of the tracks

yup. when C.R.E.A.M. he used to be my favorite MC from the Wu

[step one]

Was definitely a bit disappointed with Deck's solo album when it dropped. He always killed his verses on Clan tracks (no coincidence he was usually up first on the lead singles: both Protect Ya Necks & Triumph) as well as Gang Starr's 'Above The Clouds'.

I'll have to give it UC another listen cos although Im sure the lyrics are up to par the beats definitely are Ironman/OB4CL standard

[dubs]

Was definitely a bit disappointed with Deck's solo album when it dropped. He always killed his verses on Clan tracks (no coincidence he was usually up first on the lead singles: both Protect Ya Necks & Triumph) as well as Gang Starr's 'Above The Clouds'.

I'll have to give it UC another listen cos although Im sure the lyrics are up to par the beats definitely are Ironman/OB4CL standard

I always though this was the best track off UC...dont know the album well enough to be sure though.

[Nav]

I have always thought of Deck as a more of a verse than a song type of rapper. He was my favourite on 36 chambers.

[paul_smith]

another mention would probably be Cormega with his style from his first 2 appearances on wax, not that I don't like his post '96 style, I love it, but the earlier was on some Nasty Nas type rhyme schemes (I always say Cormega and Tragedy had a BIG influence on him).I even read somewhere that Cormega recorded with Marley Marl in the early 90s for a solo album but the material was shelved due to him being incarcerated or some other reason

Don't You mean Nas and Cormega were influenced by Tragedy? Listen to Live Motivator on Marley's In Control. Then Cormega on PHD's album, and Nas on Live @BBQ.

true, The Rebel and Live Motivator paved the way for the style that Cormega used on Hot Day's album and then on Phd's, as well as being Nas' main influence

[dubs]

Was definitely a bit disappointed with Deck's solo album when it dropped. He always killed his verses on Clan tracks (no coincidence he was usually up first on the lead singles: both Protect Ya Necks & Triumph) as well as Gang Starr's 'Above The Clouds'.

I'll have to give it UC another listen cos although Im sure the lyrics are up to par the beats definitely are Ironman/OB4CL standard

I always though this was the best track off UC...dont know the album well enough to be sure though.

oops forgot to post this song

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[fatboybrandon]

I agree on wanting to hear The Artifacts pre- 1994, I still remember the feeling I got hearing their demos on WKCR, songs like Flexi With The Tech, Check Da Fine Print.

i've always wondered what a beatnuts album might sound like had they dropped one a couple years earlier.

Here's one project that displays The Nuts early, early 90's sound before Chi Ali and their own EP, both on rhyming and production. I remember when I got this it was real interesting to hear the difference between what they sounded like on Intoxicated Demons and this. It felt like hearing the difference between No More Mr. Nice Guy & Step In The Arena.

http://www.mediafire.com/?lm4zyihjin3


1. Snatch My Crops feat. Ghetto (Produced By: Beatnuts)

2. Fashion Goes Off (Produced By: Beatnuts)

3. You Got My Back (Produced By: Beatnuts)

4. DJ Red Alert Promo 98.7 Kiss FM (Produced By: Beatnuts)

5. Catch A Lil' Wreck feat. Ronnie (Produced By: Beatnuts)

6. Do That" (Produced By: Beatnuts)

7. Props Over Here (Demo Version) (Produced By: Beatnuts)

8. In My Room (Original Version) (Produced By: Beatnuts)

[IRISH_CRAIG]

I agree on wanting to hear The Artifacts pre- 1994, I still remember the feeling I got hearing their demos on WKCR, songs like Flexi With The Tech, Check Da Fine Print

I wish the full Artifacts original demo reel produced by Lord Jamar would surface...