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drizzle wrote:the movie just shows events happening without bothering to connect or shape them into anything thematically coherent beyond the most basic archetypes. it's just a collection of dramatic bullet points: - having family was good, having them taken away from you is bad! - snow is cold, survival is hard! -betrayal! - indians! - revenge!

This is Dids-level Rap Analysis masquerading as legitimate film criticism.

Let's dispel this rumor that Man vs. Nature/Nature vs. Man are not themes explicitly explored by Inarritu:

http://www.wired.com/2015/12/inarritu-q-a/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

This film is so much about one man’s struggle. Or, struggles. In a sense, your last film, Birdman, was very much about one man’s interior struggle. It was man versus self. This film is very much about one man’s external struggle: man versus nature.

Well, it is man versus nature, but also versus himself. I have always loved Fitzcarraldo: Burden of Dreams. That is a story of man versus nature. But it is also nature versus man. I wanted to make a movie that explored those themes.

Talk to me about man versus nature.

Well, we all truly lived it to make this film. For 11 months we were in some of the most remote locations we could find in Canada and elsewhere—places where we could find truly primeval, raw wilderness. It was a real odyssey, making this film. But that is for us in the real world. Inside the film, inside the story, at the bottom of the whole thing is a father-son story. And that is something which is in all of my films. Here, it is given an extra twist because it is a father with a mixed-race son.

You have to remember that the United States at this time was basically a jungle. And I wanted, too, to see the spirit of this time and place. How nature can shape us. There were big themes here. In the 1820s, no one had crossed the continent except for Lewis and Clark. Only nature and animals ruled the continent. And Native Americans, of course. There was no Western law on the frontier. It is a world that is rarely explored in cinema. This raw world. And yet it is also in America the very beginning of capitalism. I am fascinated by that time and those men. And in the movie, nature represents the mind of the characters. So, to tell the story in an intimate way it is about fathers and sons. It’s Biblical, universal.

You see, you are a son forever. That defines you. You are someone’s child forever. And inside this story you have to remember it is a story of a man—Leo—losing his son, his child. Then then there are echoes of that. You have the chief—a father—searching for his daughter. And then you have the bear who attacks Leo and what you have to remember there is she attacks Leo for a reason: because she is protecting her cubs, her children. So, there are many strands here of sons and daughters, fathers and mothers.

'Back then there was nothing here but nature. So we shot it in nature and the movie is about that ... nature. And in this nature is a father and a son... and a father and a daughter... so you know it's about fathers and children and mothers... it's universal.. because you know... we all have a father and stuff'

LOLOLOLOL meaningless platitudes from a dude who's work is notoriously pretentious. I'm sure he had all sorts of grand intentions of saying something profound... but he didn't.

This story has about as much profound analysis of family relationships as Death Wish 2 or any other formulaic 'father avenges child' revenge movie. What it has to say about early America and capitalism is so slight it could fit into a tweet. It could take place in pretty much any wild location being broached by non-natives.

It's pretty telling that every single plaudit of this movie focuses explicitly on the cinematography and how hard it was to make. Even Innaritu himself predicates the discussion of what the movie is about on the details of the shoot. It sounds like Burden Of Dreams and not Fitzcarraldo itself was his inspiration, that's actually probably the most important quote from that interview snippet. It's all very meta - a triumph of a cinematographer getting his shot, an actor submitting to the elements, a vision of a director who thought all this shit up. The actual story being told on screen is almost besides the point, and it shows.

And "No" to your whole post.

story was weak. not rly getting what this argument is over tho. what would constitute a well executed man vs nature them if not a guy getting raped by a bear and sleeping inside a horse & shit? and snow

I agree with you on most things driz, but not this.

I think any movie that was as beautiful as this was going to have a very difficult time with the story matching it. It's simple and bludgeons you over the head a bit, but I think it was executed fairly well and suited what they were attempting visually.

Is anyone saying this is the best screenplay of all time? It's not even up for an Oscar.

movies get nominated for oscars all the time without having a shred of story or coherent thought.

look at tree of life

i mean obvz revenant is much better than that dogshit, but still

CarlosDelgothoes wrote:look at tree of life
i mean obvz revenant is much better than that dogshit, but still

Generally speaking, folks who hate on Tree of Life are the folks who can't relate to themes explored in this movie. If you've never been in a serious, long-term, monogamous relationship with another person for instance, you would hate it. If you've never given of yourself to a sacrificial degree for the sake of someone else, you would hate it. If you are a selfish person, you would hate it.

It's definitely a movie for the grown ups.

Employee wrote:Generally speaking, folks who hate on Tree of Life are the folks who can't relate to themes explored in this movie. If you've never been in a serious, long-term, monogamous relationship with another person for instance, you would hate it. If you've never given of yourself to a sacrificial degree for the sake of someone else, you would hate it. If you are a selfish person, you would hate it.

It's definitely a movie for the grown ups.

Employee wrote:Generally speaking, folks who hate on Tree of Life are the folks who can't relate to themes explored in this movie. If you've never been in a serious, long-term, monogamous relationship with another person for instance, you would hate it. If you've never given of yourself to a sacrificial degree for the sake of someone else, you would hate it. If you are a selfish person, you would hate it.

It's definitely a movie for the grown ups.

I have never done any of those things. And I think Tree of Life is a masterpiece.

Tommy Bunz wrote:

Employee wrote:Generally speaking, folks who hate on Tree of Life are the folks who can't relate to themes explored in this movie. If you've never been in a serious, long-term, monogamous relationship with another person for instance, you would hate it. If you've never given of yourself to a sacrificial degree for the sake of someone else, you would hate it. If you are a selfish person, you would hate it.

It's definitely a movie for the grown ups.

I have never done any of those things. And I think Tree of Life is a masterpiece.

Employee wrote:Generally speaking

I agree with Drizzle, this movie was fucking hot ass garbage.

Good for one watch. It was well acted and well shot. But the premise has been done to death.

awesome fucking movie. movies are more about feel and a cinematic experience right now (see interstellar gravity mad max avengers). the use of sound language music and picture was awesome. amazing performance by Leo. if he doesn't win it's garbage. he made me feel what his character was feeling just by doing it. call it charisma. call it relatability. call it raw emotion. whatever you want to call it it was premium shit and as 'cliche' as some people may feel it is I haven't seen a performance match this one for what it is (the intensity etc) in a long long time.

the only thing I can think of to knock this movie was that at multiple points I broke concentration because I was thinking like 'well this is Leo's vehicle for the oscar' 'they really want Leo to get this shit' etc

Your sob stories haven't made this film any better. It still is hot fucking garbage.

i wish icesickle were here to review this movie.

Trademark wrote:Your sob stories haven't made this film any better. It still is hot fucking garbage.

this is trying to get down to humanity at its rawest. and i think its an awesome movie.

Trademark wrote:Your sob stories haven't made this film any better. It still is hot fucking garbage.

EMCEE DARTH MALEK wrote:i wish icesickle were here to review this movie.

he's sympathize with the oppressed indigenous people who's territory is being tread on, but would think they're symbolized by the brown bear and not the actual brown people in the movie