Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

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Larry2times
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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Larry2times »

Spartan wrote:I always feel like I'm Del Boy trying to act sophisticated when I make that rare effort to read S&S in my local WH Smiths.
Ive regularly gotten that feeling with Wire, which makes S&S look like it stands for Sunday Sport n' shit. I used to actually cop it but began to suspect it wasnt worth attempting to pentrate :pause: all the not-rap articles since theyre obsessed with grime & the rap sections tiny so who the fuck is they.

Death Proofs kinda underrated. The "hes gone too far" talk went too far imho, its his most blatant rehashing but least it was a competent rehashing and wasnt as flabby/messy as Django & Inglorious.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Career Over Like Mike(NJJ) »

Only good things to come out of Death Proof were the lap dance scene to Down In Mexico, and the Grip Plyaz song it inspired, imo :

Grip Plyaz w/ Slick Pulla - Stuntman Mike


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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Larry2times »

I definitely like this song a lot more than Death Proof.

"thats your girl? thats fucked up."

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by drizzle »

Balkongen Loungin' wrote:Letter from the latest issue of S&S :
I recall Orson Welles saying something along the lines that his best advice for a first time director is never to have seen a movie before. Glib perhaps, but am I alone in growing weary of Quentin Tarantino's all-consuming pastiche approach to filmmaking?

There aren't enough years in his lifetime for Tarantino to individually pay homage to every film we get a nod and a wink to, so as many as possible go into the blender. Musical styles, cinematic tics -- the lot. The richest ingredients do not always make the best cake. Though he's a man of obvious talent, one would dearly love to have him make a film off his own bat, and Reservoir Dogs and Jackie Brown are nearest we have.

Do we really need four B Movie genres in one movie? Rather than an orgy of popular and not-so-popular culture, why not simply settle down to Giulio Questi's Django Kill? Sometimes the simplest relationships can be the most satisfying.
:cheers:
This is pretentious nonsense, wrong on several levels

Genre-blending and directors paying direct and indirect homages to their influences and repurposing them are as old as cinema itself. French New Wave, one of the most influential movements in the art form, was based on similar ideas. What the fuck do you think the shot of Bellmondo staring at the Bogart poster and trying to cock his hat like it in Breathless is all about? Similarly, Night Of The Hunter, one of the most singular and unique movies ever, has references to My Gang/Little Rascals (at a recent screening commemorating a new book about it or some such, the author directly compared Laughton to QT)

Django Unchained specifically is actually QT's most successful and straight forward genre effort. Beyond the dodgy politics and convoluted/bloated plotting, it's a fairly by the numbers homage to SWs updated with a modern sensibility. It does nod to a few other things along the way, but claiming 4 separate genres in it is extremely hyperbolic. It's relative simplicity in this regard is starkly evident in comparison to something like Kill Bill, which mashes up several flavors of martial art sub-genres along with elements of westerns and anime and modern action movies and fuck knows what else. As far as Reservoir Dogs and Jackie Brown, I can see the writer's point but it's not exactly accurate either - RB is heavily influenced by Kubrick's The Killing and Ringo Lam's City On Fire, JB is a 70s thriller/blaxplotation homage grafted on Elmore Leonard's story (who is hardly a genre purist himself).

The irony of referencing Django Kills seals the stupidity of this. That movie is far from the simple traditionalist genre entry the writer seems to consider it as, it actually features far more overt influences of other genres than Django Unchained does itself. There are obvious elements of horror and surrealism and the weird homo-erotic/S&M sexual asides Tommy mentioned, none of which are exactly 'genre pure'. That movie is in fact more of a SW anomaly, that's partially why it even got its critical re-appraisal to begin with. I get the feeling the writer doesn't actually know much about SWs in general - he probably didn't want to be too obvious and name the og Django, but there are dozens of other movies he could have named instead... and the smart-dumb faggot didn't know any of them.
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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Career Over Like Mike(NJJ) »

The difference is that Django Kills is actually a good movie with lots of weird fairly original quirks, though, whereas Djanjo Unchained basically amounts to Tarantino saying "okay guys, I ran out of ideas in 1997 so I'm gonna hit you with a smorgasbord of movie homages and in-jokes starting with the O.G Django theme. Amongst them I've got y'all a Franco Nero cameo, the theme to The Great Silence, as well as nods to Navajo Joe, The Intruder, Mandingo and Goodbye Uncle Tom so plz stay patient until the couple of good bits with Di Caprio & Jackson start in an hour or so!"

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Y@k Bollocks »

Larry2times wrote:
Spartan wrote:I always feel like I'm Del Boy trying to act sophisticated when I make that rare effort to read S&S in my local WH Smiths.
Ive regularly gotten that feeling with Wire, which makes S&S look like it stands for Sunday Sport n' shit
I buy them and Monocle for shelf decoration.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Comedy Quaddafi »

Whether to Jason of Philaflava or John Podesta, I will speak my fucking perspective openly
- MB

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by drizzle »

SchoolMeOnGodsmack wrote:The difference is that Django Kills is actually a good movie with lots of weird fairly original quirks
The concept of 'good' is entirely relative to the viewer. I thought both movies were good. That's beyond the point though. The contrast as it's being made here specifically is baseless for the reasons outlined above. The writer invokes the movie as an example of genre traditionalism and simplicity, which doesn't apply at all.

As far as the originality of quirks in Django Kills, the quirks themselves are not exactly original by any means. The novelty lies in introducing them into the SW palette, and the movie does do that well. But here's the funny part - that accomplishment actually serves to push Django Kill further into exactly the kind of genre pastiche that the writer is trying to speak against.
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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Larry2times »

Y@k Bollocks wrote:
Larry2times wrote:
Spartan wrote:I always feel like I'm Del Boy trying to act sophisticated when I make that rare effort to read S&S in my local WH Smiths.
Ive regularly gotten that feeling with Wire, which makes S&S look like it stands for Sunday Sport n' shit
I buy them and Monocle for shelf decoration.
I need to update mine, still got the Anne Franks Diary, karate manual, quran, Oscar Wilde comp etc in the folks house from when I was 15. I need to move somewhere with a bookshelf first though.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Spartan »

Genuinely tried to figure out how Django Unchained had a nod to a late eighties slasher set in a supermarket, then I realised it was the Shatner movie.

Quick question. Did anyone else think Calvin's smearing blood on Broomhilda scene was a reference to this?



The blood smear scene is cut from both the UK and US DVD and seems to only exist on the trailer and the Danish DVD release of the film.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Tommy Bunz »

Drizzle bodying thread.

Spartan, I don't think the smear was an intentional homage. Word is that blood is completely real, DiCaprio actually cut this shit out of his hand when he slammed it down and the look on Kerry Washingtons face is pure unscripted disgust. Dude's such a badass that he kept going and had to get stitches later.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by drizzle »

^^^ yea i heard that story too, Leo was really bleeding and it was all in the moment
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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Spartan »

But I thought he was meant to smear blood on her anyway, real or not. Correct?

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Cash Rulz »

Finally saw it.

Enjoyable movie. A bit long, but enjoyable. The "niggers" were not as bad as I thought it was going to be and it wasn't all beatin' slaves and shit.

I KNEW HE WAS REALLY BLEEDING!!!! I told my girl, he didn't do anything that would make him have blood on him and that shit looks like blood. Kerry Washington must've wanted to fuck his ass up after that.

Almost as gangsta as Viggo breaking his foot during Fellowship.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by PopeyeJones »

Already said I thought the first half of this was entertaining but that it fell apart once in Mississippi (really not impressed by DiCap, and SamJack in particular), but figured this was worth posting.

I know many in curb don't want politics in their popcorn, but this is really one of the best critiques of the movie I've read (if one is open to politically critiquing the movie, and some aren't -- I get that). Written by an actor from Grey's Anatomy too. For an actor this dude can write his ass off. So, yeah, I liked the movie, but liked this too. People are complicated.
Editor's note: Jesse Williams is an actor/producer who plays Dr. Jackson Avery on the TV series "Grey's Anatomy." He is a Temple University graduate and former public high school teacher. Williams founded the production company, farWord Inc. and is an executive producer of "Question Bridge: Black Males." Follow him on Twitter and Tumblr. Note: This article contains offensive language.

(CNN) -- Films such as "Django Unchained" carry with them an uncommonly high concentration of influence and opportunity. Due to the scarcity of diverse and inspiring representations on screen, Quentin Tarantino's latest movie casts a longer shadow than many are willing to acknowledge.

In a recent interview with UK Channel 4, Tarantino stated his goals and interpretation of the Oscar-nominated film's impact: "I've always wanted to explore slavery ... to give black American males a hero ... and revenge. ... I am responsible for people talking about slavery in America in a way they have not in 30 years."

He went on, "Violence on slaves hasn't been dealt with to the extent that I've dealt with it."

My personal biracial experience growing up on both sides of segregated hoods, suburbs and backcountry taught me a lot about the coded language and arithmetic of racism. I was often invisible when topics of race arose, the racial adoptee that you spoke honestly in front of.

I grew up hearing the candid dirt from both sides, and I studied it. The conversation was almost always influenced by something people read or saw on a screen. Media portrayals greatly affect, if not entirely construct, how we interpret "otherness." People see what they are shown, and little else.

It's why my dad forced me to study and value history from an absurdly young age -- to build a foundation solid enough to withstand cultural omissions from the curriculum and distortions from the media. It's what led me to become a teacher of American and African history out of college. There is a glaring difference in outlook between those who have mined the rich, empowering truth about how we've come to be, and those who just accept that there's only one or two people of African descent deemed worthy of entire history books.

If, like Tarantino, you show up with a megaphone and claim to be creating a real solution to a specific problem, I only ask that you not instead, construct something unnecessarily fake and then act like you've done us a favor.

"Django Unchained" is being projected on screens around the world, out of context: A slim percentage of consumers have any real understanding of what took place during slavery, one of history's most prolonged, barbaric and celebrated human rights violations. Sadly, for many Americans, this film is the beginning and the end of that history lesson.

This film follows a brave, cunning and fearless lead character whose name starts with a "D." Viewers of the film's trailer would think that character is Django, played by Jamie Foxx. In fact, his name is Dr. King Schultz, a German portrayed by Christoph Waltz, (spoiler alert) who sacrifices his life in the pursuit of freedom and justice for the black man. It is the white Dr. King, who after sharing a motivational tale about a man reaching a mountaintop, nobly gives his life for "black justice."

Tarantino rightly claims that the abundant use of "nigger" in the film was authentic and of the time. Of course it was. So was chattel slavery and the back-breaking manual labor that kept these massive plantations thriving.

Tarantino's plantations are nearly empty farms with well-dressed Negresses in flowing gowns, frolicking on swings and enjoying leisurely strolls through the grounds, as if the setting is Versailles, mixed in with occasional acts of barbarism against slaves.

It's the opposite of the exploration of the real phenomenon of slavery about which he boasts.

Sometimes we sacrifice accuracy for story, but these inaccuracies are completely unnecessary. How does depicting slave plantations like circus campgrounds, fit with delirious, babbling overseers wielding bull whips and overdressed rabble wandering aimlessly, further Django's truth?

The film's antagonist, Calvin Candie, played by Leonardo DiCaprio, supposedly runs one of the very worst plantations in all of Mississippi. Yet on the road he dines with his slaves, and at home, his fields are mostly empty and he only seems to have slaves in his house. Is this one of those rare slave plantations that primarily trades in polished silverware and gossip? That authenticity card that Tarantino uses to buy all those "niggers" has an awfully selective memory.

In the film's opening sequence, shackled blacks literally hold the key to their shackles and don't use them, choosing instead to trudge forward, hindered by biting chains, to kill a white man. In the third act, after seeing Django kill the Australians, the blacks sitting in an open cage neither communicate with each other or consider stepping outside of the cage.

Review: 'Django Unchained'

In fact, in this entire, nearly three-hour film, there are no scenes with black people interacting, or even looking at each other, in a respectful or productive way.

If only one black person (Django) displays the vaguest interest in gaining freedom, while the rest consistently demonstrate that they wouldn't do anything with that freedom, were they to obtain it, then we're not able to become invested in them or their pursuits: We can't relate to shiftless characters. Being illiterate, and/or brown, does not remove the ability to think, or observe or yearn or plan or develop meaningful relationships.

Despite the repeated suggestions that they are similar narratives, "Django Unchained" has little in common with "Inglourious Basterds," Tarantino's 2009 fantasy involving a band of American soldiers taking revenge against the Nazis. The latter's title characters choose to form a band of men who risk their lives for a generous and creative endeavor to stop the Holocaust completely, saving all of their people, not just one.

"Django" is just a random guy, who, to no credit of his own, was plucked from slavery by an impressive white man and led on a journey to save his wife.

"Inglourious" did not walk us through provocative scenes of concentration camp torture, gas chambers and ethnically stereotyped victims. Nor were Jewish characters subjected to the indignities of being torn apart by dogs. And while we have our trusty authenticity card out, did the Jewish people not suffer the repeated verbal onslaught of "kike," "rats" and other grotesque terms?

Were such words used in "Inglourious Basterds" more than 100 times? How about 70? OK 30? 10? Thankfully, Tarantino knew that he was perfectly able to tell a story without such gimmicks. (He also knew the community he claimed to be avenging wouldn't stand for it.)

Hey, remember when Tarantino was selling those emaciated Jewish prisoner action figures with the concentration camp tattoos? So funny and ironic and harmless, right? No. That would have been cheap and disgusting.

Yet the filmmakers agreed to the release of action-figure slave and slaver dolls to help promote "Django." It was an especially offensive decision because selling slave figurines falls directly in line with the centuries-old American tradition of desensitizing us to the horrors of slavery with cute, palatable commodities. Tarantino didn't invent this tacky strategy; he just dug it back up.

Opinion: Why 'Django' stirs race debate

Think for a moment of the lengths that Tarantino went, to create a heroic triumph for his "Inglourious Basterds." He created an imaginary scenario wherein his characters could outwit and ultimately incinerate Hitler and his top advisers in a movie theater. It was choose-your-own-adventure heroism to create figures that took complete agency in the acquisition of their freedom. A very cool idea.

A big reason slavery is avoided in American storytelling is guilt. Unlike the Holocaust, when it comes to slavery, our people were the bad guys. But we're not German, so we can rail on Hitler and the Nazis all day without thinking critically about our legacy.

For descendants of slaves, and all Americans, our ovens -- the slave plantations -- are tourist destinations and wedding venues, home to preservation societies and guided tours. The "good ole days," when faceless black folks with zero potential were merely quiet, collateral damage.

America's minimal comprehension of slavery combined with the kind of trivialization "Django" offers renders us ill-equipped to empathize with its victims. This is a chicken or the egg manipulation: "Do I know nothing about the complexity of slavery because it's not that big a deal, or must it not be that big a deal because I'm only vaguely informed?"

None of my criticisms would be different had the person in the director's chair been a different color (though all widely released American films heavily involving slavery in the United States have been directed by white men). My concerns are limited to the onscreen material, its advertised aims and the consequences.

We try so hard to distance ourselves from the generations that made a business out of systematically crippling a people and the public's vision of their abilities and intentions. We're so different now, aren't we? We are civilized.

By popular measure, so were they.

And we deserve better, than this lazy, oversimplified reduction of our history.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Employee »

PopeyeJones wrote:
If, like Tarantino, you show up with a megaphone and claim to be creating a real solution to a specific problem, I only ask that you not instead, construct something unnecessarily fake and then act like you've done us a favor.
Why is he ascribing words to Tarantino that Tarantino never said? Did he once say he "solved" any specific problem by writing and directing Django Unchained?

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Employee »

PopeyeJones wrote:
Yet the filmmakers agreed to the release of action-figure slave and slaver dolls to help promote "Django." It was an especially offensive decision because selling slave figurines falls directly in line with the centuries-old American tradition of desensitizing us to the horrors of slavery with cute, palatable commodities. Tarantino didn't invent this tacky strategy; he just dug it back up.
And this guy will go home and watch "30 Rock" tonight and further line the pockets of a rich, white man who flings racial epithets at an African-American on the street.

Worthless commentary/opinion.

"I'm cool with totally implicit racism, but overt racism pushes me over the edge."

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by drizzle »

am i crazy or were none of those toys actually in any way equivalent to a figurine of a half-dead concentration camp victim? i keep googling it and it looks like they were all of major characters, none of them were just random bloody field slaves. maybe the pics of the really bad ones were pulled too?

also, that whole campaign doesn't seem like QT's idea directly... seems like a pretty standard studio originated promotional tie-in tactic, albeit here applied in tasteless manner. QT maybe complicit in it but holding him solely responsible for it seems ott

i can def see why they would be considered offensive in any case, but this dude seems to be hyperbolizing facts simply to make his point stronger
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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Employee »

PopeyeJones wrote:
None of my criticisms would be different had the person in the director's chair been a different color (though all widely released American films heavily involving slavery in the United States have been directed by white men).
:larry:
PopeyeJones wrote:
My concerns are limited to the onscreen material, its advertised aims and the consequences.
Okay...the end of the sentence that precedes that is this:
(though all widely released American films heavily involving slavery in the United States have been directed by white men).
He, and anyone who agrees with him, has some seriously entrenched, race-based issues to confront.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Employee »

drizzle wrote:am i crazy or were none of those toys actually in any way equivalent to a figurine of a half-dead concentration camp victim? i keep googling it and it looks like they were all of major characters, none of them were just random bloody field slaves. maybe the pics of the really bad ones were pulled too?

also, that whole campaign doesn't seem like QT's idea directly... seems like a pretty standard studio originated promotional tie-in tactic, albeit here applied in tasteless manner. QT maybe complicit in it but holding him solely responsible for it seems ott

i can def see why they would be considered offensive in any case, but this dude seems to be hyperbolizing facts simply to make his point stronger
Everything about this film is designed to be incendiary: from the writing to the marketing.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Employee »

I simply fail to see how a slave outwitting and massacring the people who enslaved him, as well as performing the Herculean task of rescuing his kidnapped, slave wife, is a bad thing.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by drizzle »

i think he's also conflating some of the movie's details, though maybe the fault here is QT's for not properly telegraphing his intentions

the idea i got while watching was that Don Johnson's plantation, where you see those 'well-dressed Negresses in flowing gowns, frolicking on swings and enjoying leisurely strolls through the grounds, as if the setting is Versailles', was actually meant as something like a whore house/pleasure grounds/a place to buy bed slaves and concubines and such. which is why it's shown the way it is. in that context, there shouldn't be anything but girls frolicking there. maybe i'm projecting
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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Employee »

drizzle wrote:i think he's also conflating some of the movie's details, though maybe the fault here is QT's for not properly telegraphing his intentions

the idea i got while watching was that Don Johnson's plantation, where you see those 'well-dressed Negresses in flowing gowns, frolicking on swings and enjoying leisurely strolls through the grounds, as if the setting is Versailles', was actually meant as something like a whore house/pleasure grounds/a place to buy bed slaves and concubines and such. which is why it's shown the way it is. in that context, there shouldn't be anything but girls frolicking there. maybe i'm projecting
It is a disgusting spectacle, but that is the point: "pleasure plantations" were a disgusting spectacle. So what does Tarantino do? What he always does: amplify everything: hair, costumes, make up, sets, violence, language etc.

I'm baffled that people don't understand this.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Req »

i always thought the girls on swings was to give the juxtaposed effect of a dream-like fantasy, hence the whole point of the movie.
F.U. MOOLAH

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by PopeyeJones »

Woah. Employee firestorm of not caring about race. Mistakes were made. my bad.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Employee »

I care greatly about race relations which is why "reviews" like the one you posted offend me as viscerally as the movie allegedly does the reviewer. I've never pretended otherwise. I differ from you in that I don't base my decisions in life based in part or in whole on race in any regard. You do.

You know, White Man's Burden.

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by Tommy Bunz »

this is why we can't have nice things

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

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n/m

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

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Re: Tarantino's new movie - "Django Unchained"?

Post by khadafi »

Just saw the movie yesterday for the first time.
It was great. I like how QT uses the N word in that movie. It shows how it is just a word with bad history.
Samuel L Jackson "Stephens" character mad me angry, it was strange. I wanted that guy to be killed badly. I wonder
how many how real life "Stephens" existed.

Here is a crazy example

"Contrary to what one bit of Candie’s dialogue implies, many actual slaves were willing to band together to escape—as Cobb points out, owners were constantly in fear of rebellions and subversions. But there were also those who clung to whatever power they had. Not long after I saw the movie, my father, who’s been researching the journalistic portrayal of blacks in the Hartford Courant, one of the country’s oldest continuously published newspapers, sent me a March 17, 1859 article about two black men who were caught trying to flee their Southern owners. One of the slaves was light enough to appear “perfectly white,” according to the paper, and they boarded a train as slave and slave owner, respectively. They were reportedly undone by another black man working aboard the train, who recognized them both and informed the conductor."

Damn that is crazy!

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