Pick your favorite Westcoast chill track

[Huldrich Bullsh!t]

A lot of great songs here but "93 til" did it without sucking P-funks dick as hard so I voted for that.

besides the Souls
Luniz
pharcyde
MC Eiht
Ice Cube

definitely don't sample P-Funk

and there are some others in here I'd argue don't do either.



wanted to pich souls then, cube, then Eiht then Dre then said fuck it too hard to choose

[Blockhead]

I was more talking about the p-funk influence on production. Funk and G-funk, really. Not that I dislike it even. Most of those songs are undeniable classics. I just greatly prefer the jazzier shit. Aside from the Pharcyde and I get around, ALMOST ever song on that list is some sort of funk sample type shit. Like I said, I'm cool with it, but it's not fucking with 93 til's vibe, imo.

[Philaflava]

I know the list has classics but not one vote for Streiht Up Menace?

[Spartan]

g'yeah

[PopeyeJones]

A lot of great songs here but "93 til" did it without sucking P-funks dick as hard so I voted for that.

...

Aside from the Pharcyde and I get around, ALMOST ever song on that list is some sort of funk sample type shit. Like I said, I'm cool with it, but it's not fucking with 93 til's vibe, imo.

Good point.

I Get Around also gets bumped because in that era it was almost be secret official decree that every West Coast song that didn't sample Parliament had to sample Zapp & Roger.

Voted '93 too, but also because (said this more than once before, iirc) shooting the video in the woods up in Yosemite was some wild shit to do at that time, and and really established SOM as something different from the (SoCal) dominated West Coast scene that was popular at the time.

[PopeyeJones]

I know the list has classics but not one vote for Streiht Up Menace?

The song isn't really that chill.

It's about his dad and his friend being murdered and how unhappy he is and how trapped he feels until he gets killed too.

Shit is the West Coast version of Mind Playing Tricks on Me.

Not really some shit you're trying to listen to at a party on a sunny day:




icedits galore (youtube problems)

[Philaflava]

Dude that piano is pretty much as chill as you can get.

[PopeyeJones]

Dude that piano is pretty much as chill as you can get.

Nah, it's as elegaic as the rest of the song.

The BPM is slow, but there's nothing chill about that song, IMO.

[Philaflava]

Drive by's are chill homie.

[CheezPizza]

All of um did gewd...but I'ma give it to Cube...cuz he did great

[ackbar]

lol p-funk & zapp are like the best groups that ever existed & jazz is terrible

[Blockhead]

lol p-funk & zapp are like the best groups that ever existed & jazz is terrible

I'd rather listen to p-funk (Zapp isn't my shit though) but for sampling, jazz>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

[Huldrich Bullsh!t]

I was more talking about the p-funk influence on production. Funk and G-funk, really. Not that I dislike it even. Most of those songs are undeniable classics. I just greatly prefer the jazzier shit. Aside from the Pharcyde and I get around, ALMOST ever song on that list is some sort of funk sample type shit. Like I said, I'm cool with it, but it's not fucking with 93 til's vibe, imo.

fair enough. personally i'd exclude i get around from what you said because its pretty funky but would add Cube and Eiht

[Larry2times]

lol tryna justify picking a song by the slightly overrated NY-sounding dudes over the otherwise undisputed (some of which are game changing) classics that actually sound like theyre from the west coast.

[clark bent]

its not my favorite song on the list but for purposes of the question being asked how can you not vote g thang

[Blockhead]

lol tryna justify picking a song by the slightly overrated NY-sounding dudes over the otherwise undisputed (some of which are game changing) classics that actually sound like theyre from the west coast.

Word, souls of mischief sounded mad east coast. Them and Black moon were basically the same thing.
They created their own lane of west coast rap. Just cause it didn't have synthesizers and they didn't wear dickies didn't make it less west coast. As an east coast guy, it didn't sound or look like anything that was coming out of the east at the time. It's a was a definitively west coast thing that appealed to SOME heads on the east coast cause the production was jazzier than it was funk based. I knew plenty of NY dudes who thought it was "Too weird".

G thing might be one of the gamechanging-est songs ever in how it created it's own genre but 93' til was also hugely impactful. It literally spawned an entire breed of hip hop fan. Now, whether or not what it spawned was a good thing in the long run can be debated but it's a pretty fucking important song. and , on top of that, the beat is probably one of my all time favorites. Just my opinion but I'm pretty sure I'm not alone in that.

I feel like either people are too young to remember this kinda shit, from a different country or they're feeling a weird resentment toward the teenaged them that once loved "souls of mischief" cause it's associated with back pack shit or something. Get over it. It's okay to like rap by people who wouldn't frighten you in a dark alley.

[Balzac]

It's about his dad and his friend being murdered and how unhappy he is and how trapped he feels until he gets killed too.

Is that true?

I always thought he wrote it as a companion piece to the movie. Its pretty much follows the plot exactly.

[Balzac]

lol tryna justify picking a song by the slightly overrated NY-sounding dudes over the otherwise undisputed (some of which are game changing) classics that actually sound like theyre from the west coast.

Word, souls of mischief sounded mad east coast. Them and Black moon were basically the same thing.
They created their own lane of west coast rap. Just cause it didn't have synthesizers and they didn't wear dickies didn't make it less west coast. As an east coast guy, it didn't sound or look like anything that was coming out of the east at the time. It's a was a definitively west coast thing that appealed to SOME heads on the east coast cause the production was jazzier than it was funk based. I knew plenty of NY dudes who thought it was "Too weird".

G thing might be one of the gamechanging-est songs ever in how it created it's own genre but 93' til was also hugely impactful. It literally spawned an entire breed of hip hop fan. Now, whether or not what it spawned was a good thing in the long run can be debated but it's a pretty fucking important song. and , on top of that, the beat is probably one of my all time favorites. Just my opinion but I'm pretty sure I'm not alone in that.

I feel like either people are too young to remember this kinda shit, from a different country or they're feeling a weird resentment toward the teenaged them that once loved "souls of mischief" cause it's associated with back pack shit or something. Get over it. It's okay to like rap by people who wouldn't frighten you in a dark alley.

i think souls sounded super east coast back in the day. in fact 93 'til the song is probably the most west coast jam on that album, and it sounds east too.

its the main reason I didn't pick 93'til on the poll, it seemed out of place with the others.

i'd say the same thing about passing me by tho, so what the fuck do i know

[PopeyeJones]

It's about his dad and his friend being murdered and how unhappy he is and how trapped he feels until he gets killed too.

Is that true?

I always thought he wrote it as a companion piece to the movie. Its pretty much follows the plot exactly.

NAS IS A GUN.

(It's pretty obvious that he didn't write and record the song after having been killed in the third verse, but the song is in the first-person, and it's about what it's about).

[Balzac]

rofl

that was pretty idiotic of me.
sorry its early and this coffee is weak.

carry on..

[PopeyeJones]

^^^ all good.

i think souls sounded super east coast back in the day. in fact 93 'til the song is probably the most west coast jam on that album, and it sounds east too.

For better or for worse, "socially conscious" tinged battle rap over jazz samples was almost exclusively a Northern California thing during that time (Hiero, Mystik Journeymen, Hobo Junction, Solesides, etc.), or at least on the West Coast it felt like it was. The East Coast equivalent at the time was basically Funcrusher, and that shit didn't come out until three years later and sounded nothing like it.

At the time people there really felt like these groups (and some SoCal people like the Freestyle Fellowship & Project Blowed people, The Pharcyde, Anotha Leval, Da Wascals, etc.) were the West Coast answer to Native Tongues.

(not bringing up the NorCal "hood" shit like Too Short, RBL Posse, N2Deep, all the Sick Wid It people, Mac Mall, Mac Dre, etc. because while definitely a huge deal it was a different scene -- the Norcal equivalent of a lot of the other songs in the poll).

[Larry2times]

I feel like either people are too young to remember this kinda shit, from a different country or they're feeling a weird resentment toward the teenaged them that once loved "souls of mischief" cause it's associated with back pack shit or something. Get over it. It's okay to like rap by people who wouldn't frighten you in a dark alley.

Excellent strawman bruh. While I do still like SOM, youre right we do mostly restrict our listening habits to shit made by scary criminals because its hard to get our jollies living in an isolated bork village where the only exposure to teh kulcha is via Rap Pages pdfs and Temple Of Hip Hop's monthly newsletter.

If anyone thought something as representative of the west coast as Heiro was that wildly different its hardly surprising theyre not fit for most of the music made there. Its not even an argument that west coast rap was solely synths and 64s - Freestyle Fellowship/LL or whatever is a whole different kettle of fish ffs.

Anyone who doesnt fux with Zapp has no right to voice their opinion on west coast rap, imo.

[Blockhead]

I feel like either people are too young to remember this kinda shit, from a different country or they're feeling a weird resentment toward the teenaged them that once loved "souls of mischief" cause it's associated with back pack shit or something. Get over it. It's okay to like rap by people who wouldn't frighten you in a dark alley.

Excellent strawman bruh. While I do still like SOM, youre right we do mostly restrict our listening habits to shit made by scary criminals because its hard to get our jollies living in an isolated bork village where the only exposure to teh kulcha is via Rap Pages pdfs and Temple Of Hip Hop's monthly newsletter.

If anyone thought something as representative of the west coast as Heiro was that wildly different its hardly surprising theyre not fit for most of the music made there. Its not even an argument that west coast rap was solely synths and 64s - Freestyle Fellowship/LL or whatever is a whole different kettle of fish ffs.

Anyone who doesnt fux with Zapp has no right to voice their opinion on west coast rap, imo.

That point you quoted wasn't directed at you as much as an overall feeling of people rejecting their past music tastes (it was more aimed at the gawd Ackbar than anyone). I'm not doubting peoples love of S.O.M. (the voting seems to be making it's own case) or that it's both possible and logical that people actually prefer Dr. Dre to everything on this list. I'm just pointing out how easily we all forget the impact things had on both our music tastes and the overall movement of the music. To think the S.O.M. sounded east coast is pretty off base. Aside from both sampling jazz, the comparisons ended there. Trust me, NO ONE out east sounded like them when they dropped. Das Efx was probably the closest thing and they weren't even close.

The problem here is that this discussion began cause a few people felt "93 til" didn't fit on the list cause it's not like the other songs...cause it isn't. But it's still a west coast made track that could be described as "chill".

and for the fifth time, I don't dislike zapp at all. Of course they have jams but the fact that like 5 years of a large amount of west coast hip hop production was basically based around 5 p-funk/zapp songs did get a little tiresome.

I'm trying to not pull the "bro, you're from Ireland" card here cause I know that's kinda some cheap bullshit but, really, everything you're telling me is from outside the bubble.(unless you're not from Ireland, in which case, my bad, I thought I saw that somewhere). I may be from the east coast but I was one of the few people i knew heavily fucking with rap from all over back in the early-mid 90's. We all got our tastes and preferences but if there's one thing I am on this subject, it's informed.

[Employee]

^^^ all good.

i think souls sounded super east coast back in the day. in fact 93 'til the song is probably the most west coast jam on that album, and it sounds east too.

For better or for worse, "socially conscious" tinged battle rap over jazz samples was almost exclusively a Northern California thing during that time (Hiero, Mystik Journeymen, Hobo Junction, Solesides, etc.), or at least on the West Coast it felt like it was.

No, it wasn't and no one on the West Coast felt/feels that way unless they were introduced to said groups many years after their initial respective splashes. I'm not trying to throw shade at you, but that is a bizarre and inaccurate description of both the rap music and region being discussed.

The East Coast equivalent at the time was basically Funcrusher, and that shit didn't come out until three years later and sounded nothing like it.

What? Again, I'm not throwing shade, but what year did you start listening to rap?

[PopeyeJones]

That point you quoted wasn't directed at you as much as an overall feeling of people rejecting their past music tastes (it was more aimed at the gawd Ackbar than anyone). I'm not doubting peoples love of S.O.M. (the voting seems to be making it's own case)

Hiero is kind of a weird case (and not really rejecting past tastes, IMO) because the whole crew fell off so fucking dramatically after Fear Itself and Like It Should Be in '94 (both great, IMO), but the vast majority of late 90s and 2K- Hiero fans didn't really get into them until they all fucking sucked. Folks disavowed the fanbase and the shitty music they were putting out.

Kind of a similar trajectory to Boot Camp, with nothing but excellent releases from 93-96, and then just disappointment, except you didn't have an extra fifteen years of idiot hippies who didn't really like rap music wearing Boot Camp shirts and still swearing by every recent release.

For Hiero the turning point was No Man's Land (although many would say 3rd Eye), which wasn't absolutely horrible, but was a huge disappointment. For Boot Camp it was For The People, which again wasn't horrible, but was a huge disappointment. Casual = Sean Price too. Comparisons for days, most probably wrong.

[Employee]

That point you quoted wasn't directed at you as much as an overall feeling of people rejecting their past music tastes (it was more aimed at the gawd Ackbar than anyone). I'm not doubting peoples love of S.O.M. (the voting seems to be making it's own case)

Hiero is kind of a weird case (and not really rejecting past tastes, IMO) because the whole crew fell off so fucking dramatically after Fear Itself and Like It Should Be in '94 (both great, IMO), but the vast majority of late 90s and 2K- Hiero fans didn't really get into them until they all fucking sucked. Folks disavowed the fanbase and the shitty music they were putting out.

Kind of a similar trajectory to Boot Camp, with nothing but excellent releases from 93-96, and then just disappointment, except you didn't have an extra fifteen years of idiot hippies who didn't really like rap music wearing Boot Camp shirts and still swearing by every recent release.

For Hiero the turning point was No Man's Land (although many would say 3rd Eye), which wasn't absolutely horrible, but was a huge disappointment. For Boot Camp it was For The People, which again wasn't horrible, but was a huge disappointment. Casual = Sean Price too. Comparisons for days, most probably wrong.

Weirdest post about rap I've ever read on this board.

[Larry2times]

Not to beat a dead horse but yeah the Zapp/P-Funk getting tiresome point doesnt really hold up when you take into account most of NY's reliance on a small handful of breaks during an earlier era. Was More Bounce To The Ounce really that much more ubiquitous than Impeach the President or whatever if you rewind a few years?

Rap's reliance on and ability to flip a few standards without becoming boring is one of the best things about it, the digging over everything attitude that gained prominence in the 90s is some fuckshit when Doggystyle pisses on any other west coast album from 1993 and Del's P-Funk sampling debut pisses on his obscure jazz sampling second album.

Dont really feel like adressing how NY-centric SOM are at this point and being a mick isnt that much of a handicap in 2012. Gonna bow out anyways cos Im after noticing 93 Til' is currently topping the poll and Im too mortified to continue.

[ackbar]

i listened to hiero & pharcyde when they were first out. they were hugely popular here. but so was too $hort & gangster rap

more than geographical divides.. i remember groups like souls & pharcyde being popular w/ skateboard/pothead kids

[PopeyeJones]

what year did you start listening to rap?

Oooooh, authenticity wars.

In any case, '89, but I was in fifth grade so it was a weird collection of shit. Probably not seriously until '91 or so when I had a "job" (mowing lawns, babysitting, etc.) and had my own money to buy albums, though.

Wasn't funcrusher out for a long time but didn't have national distro? I remember reading about it and people talking about it and trading tapes in the East Bay, but it wasn't in Amoeba until much later. IIRC shit wasn't actuality "out" on the West Coast until Mystik Journeymen were already off Telegraph and selling magazines and shit.

(IIRC you're one of those batshit people who looked Future Development, right? That's where this is coming from, or just more emotive biko spillage?)

[Blockhead]

Not to beat a dead horse but yeah the Zapp/P-Funk getting tiresome point doesnt really hold up when you take into account most of NY's reliance on a small handful of breaks during an earlier era. Was More Bounce To The Ounce really that much more ubiquitous than Impeach the President or whatever if you rewind a few years?

The difference between reusing a drum break and reusing an entire loop is huge, imo.
Synthetic substitution is the most played out break (next to impeach the pres) but it's jus a drum break. More bounce is an entire loop, bass, vocals and all...that was used like five billion times. Same tune, same song. With the breaks, they'd be the backbone of what would normally be layered with other samples. "Blind alley" was the east coast equivalent to "More bounce" and it wasn't used a 1/25th as much as "more bounce" was. Maybe it's the producer in me but that's not even close to the same thing.

Rap's reliance on and ability to flip a few standards without becoming boring is one of the best things about it, the digging over everything attitude that gained prominence in the 90s is some fuckshit when Doggystyle pisses on any other west coast album from 1993 and Del's P-Funk sampling debut pisses on his obscure jazz sampling second album.

I agree 100% on del's debut shitting on his second. He was also one of the first to really delve into that sound. Before dre totally popularized it. Del's second album seemed to drop the ball where Soul of mischief first album succeeded , beatwise.
But your "flipping" point is kinda dead cause no one really "flipped" those samples. They all looped them the same way and, sometimes, just layered drum tracks under them. Dre is really the main dude who took them to another level. The majority of west coast shit that used to loops were far lazier than he was.

Dont really feel like adressing how NY-centric SOM are at this point and being a mick isnt that much of a handicap in 2012. Gonna bow out anyways cos Im after noticing 93 Til' is currently topping the poll and Im too mortified to continue.

True, but in 1993 it was having polio.