Official European Football Offseason/Euro 12/Olympics Thread

Stoned Starks · Post by **Stoned Starks** » Sat Jun 02, 2012 7:52 pm

Random question:

Do people think Abate or Maggio will start for Italy at RB? Picked Maggio in the fantasy league thing but noticed Abate is one of the top picks percentage wise for other people. Do they know something I don't?

Reason · Post by **Reason** » Sat Jun 02, 2012 8:16 pm

next week i'll be rocking my neymar jersey at brazil v argentina in the new meadowlands in jersey, bitches

Reason · Post by **Reason** » Sat Jun 02, 2012 8:17 pm

Positive A · Post by **Positive A** » Sun Jun 03, 2012 3:04 am

Stoned Starks wrote:Random question:

Do people think Abate or Maggio will start for Italy at RB? Picked Maggio in the fantasy league thing but noticed Abate is one of the top picks percentage wise for other people. Do they know something I don't?

I was going to grab maggio, but I didn't know either

Mark 563 · Post by **Mark 563** » Sun Jun 03, 2012 5:24 am

Norbert Cleaverhook wrote:
alpha wrote:I'm a complete noob at following this sport, but hasn't Chelsea been a destination since the new owner a few years back?

I'm trying to settle on a club to follow in the EPL. Arsenal seems like the easy bandwagon choice. MU/MC seem too much like the Yankees. I know MC success has been more recent. So that leaves me with Liverpool/Chelsea. I'm thinking Liverpool since they have nice kits and the "never walk alone" thing.

I know I'm out a place here, so take it easy.
as a chelsea fan, i would say newcastle or swansea. both play decent football and i reckon swansea could challenge for a europa league spot next year if they get a few good signings this summer. liverpool are on their way down and i dont think brendan rodgers will be able to save them

Supporting any of the top 8 clubs will see you branded a glory hunter.

Gain extra kudos and support a proper team with proper history - West Ham United, freshly promoted to the Premier League after a season in the N Power Championship.

Happy to be back where we belong.

Yohan · Post by **Yohan** » Sun Jun 03, 2012 5:11 pm

Reason wrote:<object width="420" height="315"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/AKGIvag0bVI?ve ... ram><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/AKGIvag0bVI?version=3&hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="420" height="315" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>

Lol @ new trick though.

Yohan · Post by **Yohan** » Sun Jun 03, 2012 5:16 pm

Also joined the Philaflava league on fantasy crap. Very hard decisions, I have a strong starting 11 but crap reserves. ill colorwayz represent.

jamrage · Post by **jamrage** » Sun Jun 03, 2012 6:57 pm

England looked alright against Belgium.

My biggest concern is that they seem content to let the other team have the ball and just drop a bunch of guys back to defend. They do have some solid counterattacking options however.

If I was Hodgson I'd start Oxlide-Chamberlain, he was great against Belgium. He's fast as fuck, and one of the few players that can actually create something on his own.

Cahill is out of Euro 12 after colliding with Joe Hart and fracturing his jaw in two places. Bring on Kelly. Jesus Christ.

Positive A · Post by **Positive A** » Mon Jun 04, 2012 11:54 am

http://inbedwithmaradona.com/euro-2012- ... 0Guide.pdf

Positive A · Post by **Positive A** » Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:19 pm

Ive been sitting on this website all day trying to order shirts. I just know what to make...

http://www.cultzeros.co.uk/default.asp

Markshot · Post by **Markshot** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 5:07 am

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news ... agawa-deal

Y@k Bollocks · Post by **Y@k Bollocks** » Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:35 am

Mark 563 wrote:Supporting any of the top 8 clubs will see you branded a glory hunter.

Gain extra kudos and support a proper team with proper history - West Ham United, freshly promoted to the Premier League after a season in the N Power Championship.

Happy to be back where we belong.

Yohan · Post by **Yohan** » Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:51 am

I wrote an in depth tactics guide about the Netherlands, anyone interested to read it?

Positive A · Post by **Positive A** » Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:56 am

Yohan wrote:I wrote an in depth tactics guide about the Netherlands, anyone interested to read it?

Yes

Yohan · Post by **Yohan** » Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:20 am

Sorry for the length, but here it is:

A short history of the Netherlands

If youגre unfamiliar with the history of the Dutch team up until now ג you are missing something. The first appearance of the Netherlands on a major tournament was in 1934, when they played in the World Cup. The Netherlands quickly rose to international prominence on the strength of the ג74 and ג78 World Cups, in which the Dutch team played the final and lost ג twice. Under the guidance of Johan Cruyff, the single most important figure in Dutch footballing history, the Netherlands lost the ג74 final against West Germany, led by Franz Beckenbauer. In ג78, with Cruyff in absentia, the Dutch once again lost the final, this time to Argentina. Mario Kempes scored twice in the extra time, allowing Argentina to win the final with 3-1. In more recent, and European Cup related, history, the Dutch team won the ג88 European Cup, with a win over Russia in the final and one brilliant goal by San Marco van Basten. The last noteworthy success of the Dutch team was in 2010, where the Netherlands reached the final and lost it ג again. This time Spain was the better side.

The road to the European Championship

The Dutch team had no problems qualifying for the 2012 European Championship in a group which consisted of The Netherlands, Sweden, Hungary, Finland, Moldova and San Marino. The Dutch team managed to win all games in their group up to the last game, save for their last game, where the Netherlands recorded a loss against Sweden. The Dutch qualified as first in their group, with 27 points in 10 games, scoring 37 goals and conceding 8. Noteworthy is that the Dutch qualified without receiving a single red card and only 4 yellow cards. Lastly, the Dutch team pulled the trigger against San Marino at home, winning 11-0. Robin van Persie headed this bonanza, scoring a grand total of 4 goals.

Klaas Jan Huntelaar, striker of German team Schalke ג04, was the top Dutch marksman in the campaign for qualification. With 12 goals (and 1 assist), Huntelaar crowned himself topscorer of the EC qualifications. Robin van Persie and Dirk Kuyt, both playing in the Premier League for respectively Arsenal and Liverpool, scored 6 goals.

Group B

The Dutch play their games in group B. Group B can be described as the strongest group in the European Cup. They will face off against Denmark, Germany and Portugal. The Dutch can be considered of three favorites in this group, alongside Germany and Portugal.

The fixtures are:

The Netherlands vs. Denmark ג june 9, 19:00 in Charkov
The Netherlands vs. Germany ג june 12, 21:45 in Charkov
The Netherlands vs. Portugal ג june 17, 21:45 in Charkov

The squad

The format is: name, club, age, caps, goals.

Goalkeepers:
1. Maarten Stekelenburg - AS Roma ג 29 ג 47 ג 0
12. Michel Vorm ג Swansea City ג 28 ג 9 ג 0
22. Tim Krul ג Newcastle United FC ג 24 ג 3 ג 0

Defenders:

2. Gregory van der Wiel ג AFC Ajax ג 24 ג 32 ג 0
3. John Heitinga ג Everton FC ג 28 ג 78 ג 7
4. Joris Mathijsen ג M

stupidregister · Post by **stupidregister** » Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:13 pm

Every time I try to play with the Dutch on FIFA, I never know what to do with them. They have so many attacking midfield options why do they play 2 defensive mids? Is Van Bommel still worth playing? Embrace the speed and creativity and Van P should lead Euro in scoring by miles with all the playmaking behind him.

Positive A · Post by **Positive A** » Thu Jun 07, 2012 6:31 pm

The only thing I can think of is that their back 4 is sketchy. That said, they played well in 2010. I'd rather see strootman in the holding role.

Positive A · Post by **Positive A** » Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:55 pm

Great. The Poles have already started with the racism. Apparently de Jong and van der wiel heard it at an open practice. Monkey noises while running laps. That didnt take long.

Mark 563 · Post by **Mark 563** » Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:42 pm

Positive A wrote:Great. The Poles have already started with the racism. Apparently de Jong and van der wiel heard it at an open practice. Monkey noises while running laps. That didnt take long.

Did you see Panorama Euro 2012 Stadiums Of Hate, that was screened on the BBC last week? It documented all the racial problems on the terraces in Poland and the Ukraine - proper Neo-Nazi stuff. You can download it easy enough from the usual TV spots. Well worth a watch.

Positive A · Post by **Positive A** » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:09 pm

Yeah I peeped it a few days ago. Crazy shit. Seriously crazy.

Stoned Starks · Post by **Stoned Starks** » Thu Jun 07, 2012 11:16 pm

Yohan, did you write that? Really good read.

Glad to see Afellay looking likely to feature. Felt real bad for him with his injury this year as he was starting to look settled at Barca after an up and down first 6 months. Can definitely be a little eratic and run himself into some bad positions, but he seems like a good fit for the system.

Yohan · Post by **Yohan** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:25 am

stupidregister wrote:Every time I try to play with the Dutch on FIFA, I never know what to do with them. They have so many attacking midfield options why do they play 2 defensive mids? Is Van Bommel still worth playing? Embrace the speed and creativity and Van P should lead Euro in scoring by miles with all the playmaking behind him.

I don't play FIFA, so I'm not sure who you should play there. The reason van Marwijk plays 2 defensive midfielders, is because of his philosophy, which is the direct opposite of Cruyff's, which is incidently also my philosophy

. Van Marwijk thinks about the squad's weaknesses, whereas Cruyff first thinks about a squad's strength. And build the team from there.

And I agree. If you try to have 65-70% of the ball in each game, there really is no need for 2 holding midfielders. And since our holding players aren't the most intelligent footballers in the team, we effectively play with one bank of 6 defenders and one bank of 4 attackers. You can never play a quick pressing game when not in posession or building up a good play. You need as many players working the channels, like two central defenders, one defensive midfielder, two wing backs, two center halves, two wingers and one striker.

Van Persie actually isn't the right fit for this Dutch team, as he tries to occupy the space behind the sole striker position. This is a good move (Messi does it too at Barcelona), but Sneijder, Robben, Affelay and sometimes van Bommel do the same thing. This leads to the congestion we spoke about and this is not a good thing. Huntelaar would never do this and stay as high up the pitch as possible, because that's his instinct as a pure striker. But picking Huntelaar over van Persie would also stifle Sneijder, who tries to play as a second striker and now sees this width occupied by Huntelaar. So van der Vaart would in turn be the most logical choice as a '10'. Provided we use van Marwijk's formation and not my preferred 4-3-3.

Positive A wrote:The only thing I can think of is that their back 4 is sketchy. That said, they played well in 2010. I'd rather see strootman in the holding role.

I do not like Strootman. He had a torrid second half of the season and was outclassed in all aspects by Vurnon Anita. He would've been the best and most logical choice, albeit from my admittedly subjective position. But van Marwijk likes to select players with whom he has a bond - Strootman played many games in the qualifications and thus was a certainty for selection. A policy I do not necessarily agree with, but it certainly keeps the players happy. If there's one thing I have to give credit to van Marwijk, it's his ability to create a team. I've never seen the Dutch so focussed as in 2010.

Stoned Starks wrote:Yohan, did you write that? Really good read.

Glad to see Afellay looking likely to feature. Felt real bad for him with his injury this year as he was starting to look settled at Barca after an up and down first 6 months. Can definitely be a little eratic and run himself into some bad positions, but he seems like a good fit for the system.

Yup, I did. Thanks! Afellay has been nothing short of amazing since his return from injury 2 games ago. I never really liked him, but it seems like he has become a much better player at Barcelona, even though he was injured for the biggest part of this season. He was far and away the best player in the last two friendlies. I'm hoping him to start, though nothing is certain. There are some reports that van Marwijk is considering starting van Persie on the left and Huntelaar as the striker. I don't think that's gonna happen, but it could very well be an option if the game against Denmark goes in the crapper.

stupidregister · Post by **stupidregister** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 4:15 am

What about 4-4-1-1 with Van P as CF and Hunt as ST with Robben/Affelay out wide with VDV and Sneijder in the middle? I'm not a big proponent of CDMs to begin with unless he's a Toure or Fellaini because of playmaking/passing ability and not to play as a watered down midfielder.

Spartan · Post by **Spartan** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 5:13 am

Come on Greece (nh).

Yohan · Post by **Yohan** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 5:15 am

stupidregister wrote:What about 4-4-1-1 with Van P as CF and Hunt as ST with Robben/Affelay out wide with VDV and Sneijder in the middle? I'm not a big proponent of CDMs to begin with unless he's a Toure or Fellaini because of playmaking/passing ability and not to play as a watered down midfielder.

Scroll down if you don't like talking about tactics. I was writing and writing and soon realized I went a little overboard. This post has now become more of a treatise on playing positional football instead of the merits of 4-3-3 as opposed to 4-4-1-1. I'm sorry folks!

I'm sorry to say, but that's one of the worst formations I've ever heard in my life. Playing with 2 banks of 4 (defenders + midfielders) means you have no player working the channels, which means you will absolutely get murdered by almost anyone. Plus, you have no natural depth because you play no wingers, and your backs are fullbacks with no direct opponent and nothing to do when in posession of the ball. You absolutely cannot play football and expect anything from it when you don't play with at least 1 controlling midfielder, unless you only play balls over the top.

The goal of building up your plays is to get the ball to one of your attacking players via passing with his face to the opponents goal. To do this, you will need the occupy space on the pitch in the most effective way possible. You will also need to think in triangles instead of squares.

Straight lines are bad in football. You'll know this if you ever played this game at a reasonable level. If you play one touch football, it's way easier to pass the ball in a 45 degree angle (triangle) than it is passing a ball in a 90 degree angle (square). Each touch on the ball will slow down the play, rendering it less effective. Therefore, you'll need to find a formation which makes sure it utilizes the space on the pitch in the best way possible.

This means players who start on the wings instead of arriving there, as in your 4-4-1-1 formation (your wide midfielder will have to bolt forward every time to get in the right position = ineffective play). One midfielder will have to drop deep to collect the ball (easier to just start with one midfielder already in the holding role) and your fullbacks have no way to go. Especially since most teams don't field 'pure' wingers. They don't have to provide width (your wide midfielders already do this) nor depth (same). This means you'll have 2 players less to utilize when you build up your play.

In the picture provided above, you'll see one example of build up play. Essentially, these are three different moments glued together (1 & 2, 3 & 4, 5 & 6). It's rare to see these 6 steps being put into play all at the same time. A straight line means the ball is being played, the broken line means player movement off the ball.

Moment 1: the right central defender plays the ball in the feet of the holding midfielder (1), who in turn passes the ball in the feet of the left central defender (2). This is better than passing the ball from the right central defender directly into the feet of the left central defender, because you only need one opponent to shut that play down as opposed to the 2-3 you need to shut moment 1 down. It's also easier for the left central defender to control the ball and think about attacking, because he's already facing the opponents goal.

Moment 2: The left central defender passes the ball in the feet of the left midfielder (3), who in turn passes the ball in the feet of the controlling midfielder, who has just moved higher up the pitch (4). Again, this is harder to defend than straight up passing the ball from the left central defender to the holding defender.

Moment 3: The holding midfielder passes the ball to the right midfielder (5), who passes the ball to the left midfielder, who has made a run from deep and is now facing the goal, ready to do something special with it. He can now 1. attempt a one-on-one, 2. pass the ball wide to a winger or 3. attempt a through ball to a striker.

Football in its most base form is nothing more than continuously finding space and utilizing it. To do this, you'll need 1. intelligent players, 2. a dynamic formation and 3. technical players. In England, it's expected of central defenders, defensive midfielders and in some cases the full backs to just shut down your direct opponent and nothing more. In Holland, we want intelligent defenders with vision and at least some technical abilities. Right now, we are lacking in this area, which makes us weak. van Marwijk thinks the right way is to re

Norbert Cleaverhook · Fri Jun 08, 2012 12:38 pm

under 8's match in poland haha

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Stoned Starks · Post by **Stoned Starks** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 6:29 pm

Word to Yohan. Also, I don't get the feeling Sneijder (or VdV for that matter) would be very good in a deeper role like in a 4411. They're too used to drifting, and aren't particularly positionally sound (not a knock. It's part of what makes them so good to begin with). Which is kind of why the Sneijder to ManU rumors don't make much sense to me, especially with them grabbing Kagawa (who basically plays a similar role). What Man U needs is an Anita like player.

Mark 563 · Post by **Mark 563** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 6:30 pm

Cracking opening game - 2 red cards, penalty save, etc.

The Russia Czech game was good too - looked like a lot of people had Czech as their keeper, so would have dropped some points.

Good start to the tournament.

Positive A · Post by **Positive A** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:22 pm

Had to DVR the games but just finished watching. I will be avoiding the internet and media throughout my work days which makes downtime boring as shizz...anyway:

Dzagoev was spectacularly good. Unreal.

Arshavin too. He was a complete maestro out there.

Russia is a very, very good, bright team.

Pav >

For the opening 20 minutes, Poland (especially the Dortmund trio) were sensational. Fucking Malakas though, eh? They are tough to crack.

Sotiris DID end up playing but definitely didn't see enough of the ball. He can make shit happen, but the Greeks aren't assertive like that. Samaras is such a strange player. Great at keeping possession and getting the ball out to another player, but I guy with his height and build should be strong in the air.

As far as

fantasy:

I had Dzagoev, Zhirkov, Piszczek with strong performances. Szchezny on the bench (thank god) and Fetfadzidis didn't see the pitch.

Positive A · Post by **Positive A** » Fri Jun 08, 2012 11:23 pm

Who is Candy Painted Kadlec?

Great day.