The Best Player from the 90's Drafts

[Gregg Popabitch]

I was trying to figure out a way to define a generation in the NBA and the best way I could think up was the decade the player was drafted in sooooooo roll with this even if you don't agree. However, if you have a better idea, please feel free to present it in here.

Out of the group of players from that decade, 3 players stand above the rest: Duncan, Kobe, and Shaq.

Some of you may say players like Kidd, Iverson, Dirk, and Garnett deserve to be in this poll but there is one thing that separates the former group from the latter.....multiple championships.

Vote for who you think is the best player out of that generation of ballers.

[peanut butter]

PEACE

[Gregg Popabitch]

Dag, ESPN just dropped a couple articles stating their case.

[Reason]

EASILY td for me

[naturalborn103]

Where kg at!? And shaq was most dominate in his prime of the three, but Duncan career is the best.

[alpha]

Shaq. Best player, not the best career for me

[capable_keL]

there are no wrong answers

[Gregg Popabitch]

Where kg at!? And shaq was most dominate in his prime of the three, but Duncan career is the best.

DO YOU READ?

[naturalborn103]

No, you idiot!! Reading... phsss

[naturalborn103]

On a serious note, who the hell voted for Kobe??

[capable_keL]

Where kg at!? And shaq was most dominate in his prime of the three, but Duncan career is the best.

DO YOU READ?

well, KG could have got more rings if he didn't take all the money leaving nothing for other players. but that's what kind of guy he is

[Gregg Popabitch]

Where kg at!? And shaq was most dominate in his prime of the three, but Duncan career is the best.

DO YOU READ?

well, KG could have got more rings if he didn't take all the money leaving nothing for other players. but that's what kind of guy he is

Also, if he had anywhere near the offensive post game that Duncan had/has.

[naturalborn103]

Where kg at!? And shaq was most dominate in his prime of the three, but Duncan career is the best.

DO YOU READ?

well, KG could have got more rings if he didn't take all the money leaving nothing for other players. but that's what kind of guy he is

Also, if he had anywhere near the offensive post game that Duncan had/has.

KG never had the talent or coaching that Duncan had. That is not fair to say.

[alpha]

Is everyone forgetting 90s Shaq and only remembering how terrible he is on TNT?

[Gregg Popabitch]

Where kg at!? And shaq was most dominate in his prime of the three, but Duncan career is the best.

DO YOU READ?

well, KG could have got more rings if he didn't take all the money leaving nothing for other players. but that's what kind of guy he is

Also, if he had anywhere near the offensive post game that Duncan had/has.

KG never had the talent or coaching that Duncan had. That is not fair to say.

The not having talent around him is one thing but the coaching? I'm not going to prospect that KG is as good a player or better than anyone on this list because he MIGHT have been a better post player with a good coach. That's just ridiculous.

[Gregg Popabitch]

Is everyone forgetting 90s Shaq and only remembering how terrible he is on TNT?

Shaq's prime is better than anyone on this list but Shaq also fell off faster and harder (mainly because he stopped believing in conditioning and stopped showing as much effort on defense).

[naturalborn103]

That is not what I meant. I was saying the impact having one of best coaches ever has on helping a team win a chip, not the impact it has on one player getting better.

[Gregg Popabitch]

Even though I am completely in line with the idea that a coach can impact a player's progression/evolution, it is impossible to use that in a context of comparing two players.

I do hear what you're saying about coaching but it is what it is at this point.

But would you really take KG over Duncan?

Defensively, it's a wash but offensively, Duncan has so much more to offer. It's the reason why he's been better over the last 4 years than KG has been. He is just a more skilled offensive player in terms of getting his own buckets so when he declined athletically, he'd still be effective. .

[naturalborn103]

Even though I am completely in line with the idea that a coach can impact a player's progression/evolution, it is impossible to use that in a context of comparing two players.

I do hear what you're saying about coaching but it is what it is at this point.

But would you really take KG over Duncan?

Defensively, it's a wash but offensively, Duncan has so much more to offer. It's the reason why he's been better over the last 4 years than KG has been. He is just a more skilled offensive player in terms of getting his own buckets so when he declined athletically, he'd still be effective. .

I think we agree on pretty much everything. I was just saying your statement saying KG would have more chips if he had better low post game is not fair. Regardless of that his coaching and teammates would of not allowed it to happen.

At their peaks I have it Shaq > Duncan > KG > Kobe. For whole career I have it as Duncan > KG > Shaq > Kobe. Wouldn't be mad at career KG and Shaq being switched. I do think there is sizable difference between KG and Kobe though.

[capable_keL]

Where kg at!? And shaq was most dominate in his prime of the three, but Duncan career is the best.

DO YOU READ?

well, KG could have got more rings if he didn't take all the money leaving nothing for other players. but that's what kind of guy he is

Also, if he had anywhere near the offensive post game that Duncan had/has.

you don't like a seven footer who goes right to the fade away in the post?

[Gregg Popabitch]

I was just saying your statement saying KG would have more chips if he had better low post game is not fair.

I'll tell you what, his teams would have been much better off. The one thing I'll always hold against KG is the fact that I never felt he was a true #1 scorer and would have been better off as a #2 scorer. I hold players who have that type of ability in extremely high regard because this is an extremely tough thing to achieve. People can hate on Kobe's efficiency but he had the skill set and the mentality but he took it to too far an extreme. This is why I felt KG and Pierce was a perfect pairing (along with Allen of course).

I think Kobe and KG are on the same tier for this reason. Many of you may disagree with that assessment. But hey, it's how I feel and a part of my basketball philosophy.

That being said, maybe KG and Kidd should be on here.

[naturalborn103]

I was just saying your statement saying KG would have more chips if he had better low post game is not fair.

I'll tell you what, his teams would have been much better off. The one thing I'll always hold against KG is the fact that I never felt he was a true #1 scorer and would have been better off as a #2 scorer. I hold players who have that type of ability in extremely high regard because this is an extremely tough thing to achieve. People can hate on Kobe's efficiency but he had the skill set and the mentality but he took it to too far an extreme. This is why I felt KG and Pierce was a perfect pairing (along with Allen of course).

I think Kobe and KG are on the same tier for this reason. Many of you may disagree with that assessment. But hey, it's how I feel and a part of my basketball philosophy.

That being said, maybe KG and Kidd should be on here.

I think most people here agree with you and not me on this one.

To put it simply I think the gap between KG and Kobe on offense is extremely small compared to the gap on defense (and rebounding if you count it as a 3rd thing).

[Shade Tree]

I mean, I prefer KG to Shaq as a human (which is, admittedly, like preferring hemorhoids to herpes), but holy fuck are they not even close in careers. KG may have had more ability in several areas, but the era he mostly played in did not give a fuck about that and instead cheered as Shaq drove his ass into someone's gut and then dunked in the post.

That said, Kobe is not on KG's level, nevermind Duncan or Shaq. Primary scorer, second most important player on every title team.

[drobizhek]

I was just saying your statement saying KG would have more chips if he had better low post game is not fair.

I'll tell you what, his teams would have been much better off. The one thing I'll always hold against KG is the fact that I never felt he was a true #1 scorer and would have been better off as a #2 scorer. I hold players who have that type of ability in extremely high regard because this is an extremely tough thing to achieve. People can hate on Kobe's efficiency but he had the skill set and the mentality but he took it to too far an extreme. This is why I felt KG and Pierce was a perfect pairing (along with Allen of course).

I think Kobe and KG are on the same tier for this reason. Many of you may disagree with that assessment. But hey, it's how I feel and a part of my basketball philosophy.

That being said, maybe KG and Kidd should be on here.

I think most people here agree with you and not me on this one.

To put it simply I think the gap between KG and Kobe on offense is extremely small compared to the gap on defense (and rebounding if you count it as a 3rd thing).

You think the difference between Garnett and Kobe on offense is extremely small? I just don't think that the case.

[VideoKilledThe]

Voted Duncan without much hesitation. Tough to compare Kobe to two of the best bigmen in the history of the game, so really the question is Duncan or Shaq? I'll take Duncan over Shaq all day eerrrday.

[Shade Tree]

You think the difference between Garnett and Kobe on offense is extremely small? I just don't think that the case.

I think he's saying Kobe is not as much better at offense as Garnett is better at D. I'd agree: Garnett as a defender is all world, especially in the era of deep system defense. He's not just a better individual defender than Kobe is an individual offensive player (especially given that with Kobe that basically means scorer, since his interest in passing comes but mostly goes), he raised the defensive level of the entire team (strong rotations, keeping people accountable, great communication). Think about what it takes in sheer will to make Ray Allen an above-average defender.

Boston's title was not winnable without Garnett in his role (the only player who could have filled it otherwise is Duncan, who is I think the best power forward of all time and I'm not sure who else is in that discussion), but you could toss in a few good scoring wings into Kobe's titles: pre-baby McGrady, Ray Allen, Wade, Paul Pierce, Michael Redd, Reggie Miller for the Shaq titles, Brandon Roy when he had knees, Manu (and just for the sake of arguement/trolling Vince Carter, Gilbert Arenas and AI). He's better than most of those players: careerwise I'd put him ahead but in viewing range of Jesus, Reggie and Manu, about level with Wade (who will fall in the long-run because of injuries), and a big jump ahead of everyone else (though peaks are much more arguable, given that Kobe's best statistical seasons are just awful years for the Lakers, and I value Wade and Manu at their best ahead of Kobe). But the Shaq titles don't give a shit who's the wing scorer as long as they score reasonably efficiently (so, really, the AI talk above is just trolling), and the Pau titles need a top-6 at the position player.

People talk a lot about how Shaq left points/titles on the table because he refused to work hard and get the most out of himself, and that's true (there is a reason he's never really in the GOAT discussion, though he was more dominant in his peak 2-3 years than anyone but Jordan and Russell). I see Kobe as having a similar issue: if he applied the will he used to try to define his career narrative and public image post-Colorado to defending (and I'm not talking about a showy defensive possesion or two per game, but a sustained defensive presence and identity) or raising the level of his teams' offense (there can be no doubt he applied his will maniacally to his personal offensive skill set), he might have been a legit GOAT candidate; but he didn't and isn't, and all the narrative spin and self-mythologizing in the world isn't changing that. And the proof is in the pudding: when the Lakers were his team, he couldn't get them out of the first round, even blowing a 3-1 series lead over the Suns. Take Pau and Shaq out of his career and he looks like T-Mac, only his self-aggrandisement would look more ridiculous than T-Mac's avoiding of accountability. In Garnett's class, certainly, but a bit below; not touching Duncan or Shaq.

[drobizhek]

I see. It that's the case I agree with it. Although when Kobe was without Pau/Shaq he had some really shitty teams so I wouldn't say it was mostly his fault.

[jazzmatazz23]

Agreed. Shaq had the best prime and the most potential of the three. Duncan and Kobes longevity have both been unbelievable.

Reason why I chose Duncan is at his age he can be a great teammate and fit into any role, whether it be the #1 option or the #4 option on the team.

Is everyone forgetting 90s Shaq and only remembering how terrible he is on TNT?

Shaq's prime is better than anyone on this list but Shaq also fell off faster and harder (mainly because he stopped believing in conditioning and stopped showing as much effort on defense).