2014 MLB Season Thread

[peanut butter]

PEACE

[ThaJim2]

^He fucking nails it.

[Philaflava]

Top 3-4 all-around SS of all-time but The OB is 100% accurate.

[Random Sample]

Pirates back to the post season.

[alpha]

I don't read rob neyer, but is he a good writer?

I bring this up because he comes across like an idiot on Twitter.

[peanut butter]

Tommy rides for him. I'm of the opinion that while I respect the role he played as a Sabermetrics writer who pioneered bringing analytics in to the mainstream, he's also past his prime. There's a whole generation of writers who grew up reading him who are doing it much better today. He's alot like Joe Sheehan in that regard. And yea, Neyer a big fuckin weirdo, which is why I unfollowed him on Twitter.


PEACE

[Ramen]

I like baseball but I only watch Dodgers games, but because of their tv deal I've only been able to watch 4 games this season including this one to clinch the west.

bummed/estatic

Dodgers tho.

[alpha]

Dodger fans, regardless of what happens this year, have to be happy knowing they will spend more than the yankees going forward.

Even if the Giants win the playoff game, not excited about their chances of winning the first round.

They need to sign a leadoff hitter type next offseason.

[Philaflava]

How many more seasons like this before we declare Kershaw > Pedro?

[Tommy Bunz]

Tommy rides for him. I'm of the opinion that while I respect the role he played as a Sabermetrics writer who pioneered bringing analytics in to the mainstream, he's also past his prime. There's a whole generation of writers who grew up reading him who are doing it much better today. He's alot like Joe Sheehan in that regard. And yea, Neyer a big fuckin weirdo, which is why I unfollowed him on Twitter.


PEACE

I was a big fan of Neyer back when he wrote for ESPN. Him and KLaw were the two writers that really changed the way I looked at the sport in a lot of ways.
But I really haven't followed him that much since.

[Tommy Bunz]

How many more seasons like this before we declare Kershaw > Pedro?

He's better than Koufax. He's not nearly as good as Pedro was.

[Philaflava]

How many more seasons like this before we declare Kershaw > Pedro?

He's better than Koufax. He's not nearly as good as Pedro was.

First, he isn't better than Koufax you Jew-hater. Second, I said how many more seasons like this before we say he is better than Pedro. I wasn't implying he is better today.

[capable_keL]

How many more seasons like this before we declare Kershaw > Pedro?

He's better than Koufax

[Tommy Bunz]

Koufax only had 5 elite seasons and he was doing it during a deadball era with larger strikezones, shittier competition and a higher mound.
Kershaw's been doing this shit for 6 seasons now.

[Philaflava]

​I say this for the others because you clearly already made up your mind. Koufax pitched WAAAAAAAAAY more innings since you're comparing those selective years. HE pitched well over 300 innings 3x during that span. Kershaw just passed 200 last night. I know it's a different time with RP but Koufax also lead the league in completed games too. 27x times in a row during that year. Because he pitched hundreds of more innings than Kershaw during these years, he faced WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more batters.

As for "shitty" competition. Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Roberto Clemente, Willie McCovey, Ernie Banks, Frank Robinson, Stan Musial, Orlando Cepeda, Pete Rose and Willie Stargell just to name a few. All HOF (save Pete). How many talents do we have in the NL right now that compare?

Curt fucking Flood was the only guy who gave Koufax trouble. GTFOH current thinking Nazi.

[alpha]

Koufax>Pedro>Kershaw

[Tommy Bunz]

​I say this for the others because you clearly already made up your mind. Koufax pitched WAAAAAAAAAY more innings since you're comparing those selective years. HE pitched well over 300 innings 3x during that span. Kershaw just passed 200 last night. I know it's a different time with RP but Koufax also lead the league in completed games too. 27x times in a row during that year. Because he pitched hundreds of more innings than Kershaw during these years, he faced WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more batters.

As for "shitty" competition. Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Roberto Clemente, Willie McCovey, Ernie Banks, Frank Robinson, Stan Musial, Orlando Cepeda, Pete Rose and Willie Stargell just to name a few. All HOF (save Pete). How many talents do we have in the NL right now that compare?

Curt fucking Flood was the only guy who gave Koufax trouble. GTFOH current thinking Nazi.

I knew I could troll a great response out of you with this.
WAR takes into account innings pitched. Koufax's six good seasons amounted to 46.6. Kershaw's WAR is at 38.3 in his first six seasons.
WAR only compares a players stats to their peers at the time though, and doesn't adjust to the current level of competition.
It was much easier to pitch back then, the strike zone was almost twice as big as it is now and the mound was much higher which gave pitcher's a significant edge. The talent pool was much smaller as well, as the influx of hispanic talent into the league had yet to occur. He pitched against some of the best players ever, he also pitched to way more light-hitting pussies than are in baseball now.
I don't know why you refuse to acknowledge this. Koufax could not do what he did in today's environment. Rose-tinted glasses motherfucker.

Also for the record, I'm 25% Hungarian so there were some Jews in my family tree.

Neither one is near Pedro at his prime, who put up a total of 52.5 WAR in his best six seasons, at the peak of the steroid era in the highest scoring run environment in the history of the league.

[Kid That's Lifeless]

​I say this for the others because you clearly already made up your mind. Koufax pitched WAAAAAAAAAY more innings since you're comparing those selective years. HE pitched well over 300 innings 3x during that span. Kershaw just passed 200 last night. I know it's a different time with RP but Koufax also lead the league in completed games too. 27x times in a row during that year. Because he pitched hundreds of more innings than Kershaw during these years, he faced WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more batters.

As for "shitty" competition. Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Roberto Clemente, Willie McCovey, Ernie Banks, Frank Robinson, Stan Musial, Orlando Cepeda, Pete Rose and Willie Stargell just to name a few. All HOF (save Pete). How many talents do we have in the NL right now that compare?

Curt fucking Flood was the only guy who gave Koufax trouble. GTFOH current thinking Nazi.

You know he missed like 6 weeks right?

[Philaflava]

​I say this for the others because you clearly already made up your mind. Koufax pitched WAAAAAAAAAY more innings since you're comparing those selective years. HE pitched well over 300 innings 3x during that span. Kershaw just passed 200 last night. I know it's a different time with RP but Koufax also lead the league in completed games too. 27x times in a row during that year. Because he pitched hundreds of more innings than Kershaw during these years, he faced WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more batters.

As for "shitty" competition. Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Roberto Clemente, Willie McCovey, Ernie Banks, Frank Robinson, Stan Musial, Orlando Cepeda, Pete Rose and Willie Stargell just to name a few. All HOF (save Pete). How many talents do we have in the NL right now that compare?

Curt fucking Flood was the only guy who gave Koufax trouble. GTFOH current thinking Nazi.

You know he missed like 6 weeks right?

I know and he missed no time the years before and still never pitched more than 236 innings. Come back to this thread when you're of legal age.

From '61-66

1961: 255.2 -
1962 184.1
1963 311.0
1964 223.0
1965 335.2
1966 323.0

[capable_keL]

Obviously we are glossing over the fact that today's pitchers benefit from dozens of rules, that all favor the pitcher, that Sandy never had the benefit of

...obviously

[Kid That's Lifeless]

​I say this for the others because you clearly already made up your mind. Koufax pitched WAAAAAAAAAY more innings since you're comparing those selective years. HE pitched well over 300 innings 3x during that span. Kershaw just passed 200 last night. I know it's a different time with RP but Koufax also lead the league in completed games too. 27x times in a row during that year. Because he pitched hundreds of more innings than Kershaw during these years, he faced WAAAAAAAAAAAAAY more batters.

As for "shitty" competition. Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Roberto Clemente, Willie McCovey, Ernie Banks, Frank Robinson, Stan Musial, Orlando Cepeda, Pete Rose and Willie Stargell just to name a few. All HOF (save Pete). How many talents do we have in the NL right now that compare?

Curt fucking Flood was the only guy who gave Koufax trouble. GTFOH current thinking Nazi.

You know he missed like 6 weeks right?

I know and he missed no time the years before and still never pitched more than 236 innings. Come back to this thread when you're of legal age.

From '61-66

1961: 255.2 -
1962 184.1
1963 311.0
1964 223.0
1965 335.2
1966 323.0

Playing the age card while propping up a player that retired before you were born.

[peanut butter]

Baseball players today are the most talented in the history of the sport. There's no way Koufax could have done what Kershaw is doing now, much less what Pedro did at the turn of the century when the offensive environment was at its absolute peak


PEACE

[capable_keL]

Baseball players today are the most talented in the history of the sport. There's no way Koufax could have done what Kershaw is doing now, much less what Pedro did at the turn of the century when the offensive environment was at its absolute peak


PEACE

you don't know that for sure but it's a normal argument to make. still, the fact remains that Sandy was a better MLB pitcher than Kershaw. period.

[Philaflava]

People are more talented yes. LeBron is more talented and athletic than Dr J, Russell, Chamberlain, Pistol Pete, Jerry West or Michael Jordan ever was, but still. Today the talent pool is not the same as those I mentioned during the "prime" seasons Koufax faced. There is no way around it. Count the 1st ballot HOF right now in the NL and compare to what I posted.

Kershaw could definitely become better and this season is among the best ever. Maybe top 5 when you factor in

'63 Koufax
'68 Gibson
'84 Gooden
'99 Pedro

[capable_keL]

Before the 80s guys were still dribbling with one hand.

There's a reason Jordan thought a guy like Adam Morrison or Kwame Brown was gonna light up the NBA, it's because he would've dominated in the 80s.

please don't fall into :gayzoos: logic. please...please

[Philaflava]

[Tommy Bunz]

People are more talented yes. LeBron is more talented and athletic than Dr J, Russell, Chamberlain, Pistol Pete, Jerry West or Michael Jordan ever was, but still. Today the talent pool is not the same as those I mentioned during the "prime" seasons Koufax faced. There is no way around it. Count the 1st ballot HOF right now in the NL and compare to what I posted.

Kershaw could definitely become better and this season is among the best ever. Maybe top 5 when you factor in

'63 Koufax
'68 Gibson
'84 Gooden
'99 Pedro

No way. Get off the hype machine. Clayton is only pushing 7.6 WAR so far. Even if he didn't miss time and he managed to pitch this well for those innings, he's still not topping 8.5 WAR. There are way too many 10+ WAR seasons for Clayton to even sniff a ranking.

Randy Johnson, Steve Carlton & Clemens all had multiple 10+ WAR seasons. Go look at them and get your head blown.

[Tweak Da Leak]

Before the 80s guys were still dribbling with one hand.

There's a reason Jordan thought a guy like Adam Morrison or Kwame Brown was gonna light up the NBA, it's because he would've dominated in the 80s.

please don't fall into :gayzoos: logic. please...please

LOL old man Wilt dominated young Kareem, Old man Kareem dominated young Hakeem, old man Hakeem dominated young Shaq, old man Shaq dominated young Howard.

[Philaflava]

People are more talented yes. LeBron is more talented and athletic than Dr J, Russell, Chamberlain, Pistol Pete, Jerry West or Michael Jordan ever was, but still. Today the talent pool is not the same as those I mentioned during the "prime" seasons Koufax faced. There is no way around it. Count the 1st ballot HOF right now in the NL and compare to what I posted.

Kershaw could definitely become better and this season is among the best ever. Maybe top 5 when you factor in

'63 Koufax
'68 Gibson
'84 Gooden
'99 Pedro

No way. Get off the hype machine. Clayton is only pushing 7.6 WAR so far. Even if he didn't miss time and he managed to pitch this well for those innings, he's still not topping 8.5 WAR. There are way too many 10+ WAR seasons for Clayton to even sniff a ranking.

Randy Johnson, Steve Carlton & Clemens all had multiple 10+ WAR seasons. Go look at them and get your head blown.

'01 Johnson is right there. The '72 season Carlton clocked a 12 WAR, highest for any SP in their magical season, he also threw 346 innings.

http://joeposnanski.com/joeblogs/no-53-steve-carlton/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

STILL

Koufax >

[peanut butter]

Today the talent pool is not the same as those I mentioned during the "prime" seasons Koufax faced. There is no way around it. Count the 1st ballot HOF right now in the NL and compare to what I posted.

You're not adjusting for era when talking about first ballot Hall Of Famers. Today's players are being held to standards that were established when it was an entirely different sport. Ryan Howard isn't gonna make the Hall Of Fame, because he's not gonna hit 500 homers, or drive in 1,500 runs, or get 2,000 hits. But he played in an era when the replacement level player is better than ever before, not to be mention specialized relievers and use of the shift became in vogue. Can you imagine what Ryan Howard would have done in 1959? He'd probably hit 600 home runs in his career. Alternatively, Willie McCovey hit .270/.375/.515 for 20 years, because he was playing against guys like Gene Conley, who quit baseball in the middle of his first season to go play in the fuckin NBA. Because you could do that back then. Because professional sports were bullshit compared to what they are now.


PEACE